Bear was great and better than Joe, he never lost to Joe. Totally outcoached him in the '79 Sugar Bowl.
Not hard to see Campbell is bulking up in the trenches like many have wanted for years...
- Thread starter Bwifan
- Start date
Was he worse than Franklin? I also would like to see that stat from '66 to mid 90s or '99 whatever. Capture Joe in his prime not the old Joe who should have been retired. Yeah I get he was the coach but he clearly was not the same in the 2000's as he was in the 70s and 80s.
Of course he wasn’t worse than Franklin and no one is saying he was. The problem is the selective memory of some about the greatness of Joe’s record against top teams. Yes, he won some big games but he also lost a lot of big games. And he played some tough schedules but he didn’t have the top one or two teams in the country on his schedule every year like Franklin did.
Yes he lost some big games. Who hasn't? I guess your point is if you made Joe play the schedile Franklin had to play he also would have lost every game to OSU? You admit Joe had a better record in big games than Franklin because you have to since everybody has a better big game record than Franklin. But then you kinda squirm out of giving Joe much credit by saying he didn't play top teams. Sooo, I guess in your mind Joe and Franklin both could not beat the top one or two teams. The 1983 Sugar Bowl, the 1987 Fiesta Bowl, the 1990 ND game, the 1981 Pitt game, 1982 Nebraska game, 1986 Alabama game and more say "Hi".
Yes.
I can add 1-100 in in my head in under 10 seconds. How about you?
Is grammar helping your portfolio?
Did you duck when the point went over your head? Comparing the two is apples to oranges….those games you’re bringing up, how would Joe’s record have been if he played one or two of those games every year?
He would have won some of them. Do you literally think he was going to lose them all like Franklin did?
He played Nebraska in '81 and '82 and beat them both times. He played Notre Dame 10 straight years and won 6 or 7 of them. Your point is weak. You are desperately trying to come up with scenarios that make Franklin and Joe equals in big games.
Next you are going to tell me that Joe was super lucky to beat Miami in the Fiesta Bowl and if he had played whomever the 3rd ranked team that year was he would have lost. Same when he won the Sugar Bowl vs Georgia. I am sure in your mind he was lucky.
Back to Franklin. I wish it was just him losing
to the very best each year because we would have made the playoff many more times. Let's see...
Pitt in 2016, were they top 2??
Michigan State in 2017, were they top 2??
Michigan State in 2018, were they top 2?Michigan? Kentucky?
Minnesota in 2019, top 2 team?
2020 all those teams he lost to... like 5 or 6 whatever it was.... all top 2??
2021, Iowa, Illinois (ah yes, wonderful memories of that Illinois game - and of course Joe would have lost that game too), Michigan State, Arkansas???
2022 Yay! I'll give it to you with his 2 losses to top teams
2023 Yay again!!
2024 Yep
2025?? Well never mind
So Franklin lost to only top teams and got screwed by having to play OSU every year. I guess that is your point even though his losses were only limited to the top teams
in 3 out of 10 seasons.
Not really…when they played, PSU (and Pitt during 1970s) more than held their own in the field - where it counted. Check the records - including games against top teams. Btw, from 1950-2000 had the best overall records against top teams.
Texas? Missouri? LSU? ICLA? And ither great teams. Yes, selective memory can be a curse…perhaps you should see a doctor?
Many of those teams were excellent teams. Don’t compare them to today’s versions. Again - just check the actual records.
Not getting carried away…just acknowledging what was done in field. Check the records.
Which was many, many orders of magnitude than anything Franklin ever dreamed.
Again, it wasn’t about Franklin, it’s about the selective memory regarding Paterno. Should I list every season Joe had and the games he lost to teams not ranked in the top 5??? Because there were a lot of them.
I hear what you’re saying, but isn’t that inherent in playing top 10 teams? If PSU won 1/3 of games against top 10 teams, it would be an improvement over the past several years.
Okay he lost some games to non top 5 teams. Is that actually news? He also was not very good in his later years but did produce the 2005 season.
And he lost 70% of his games against the top 5….thats the point. Playing in a conference with two or three consistent top 5 teams is different than what Joe had to face.
