... Shai was a 4 Star pg. He ended up alright
Duval was ranked 5th in the country out of high school. He went undrafted ....
- Thread starter Grandroyal
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Williams from Texas A & M hurt himself by coming back to. He was projected as a lottery pick last year if memory serves me correct and this year he went late 1st round. Not a huge drop but a drop none the less.
But now he is with the Celtics. He did lose quite a bit of money on his first contract, but a report I read last night, this sets himself up quite nicely for a second contract if he produces well within the Celtics organization.
I hope Cole Anthony is paying attention.
... BUT, but, but, these guys would've been lottery picks no matter what school they went to..
Malik Newman
Alonzo Trier
Trevon Duval
All say hello.
Malik Newman
Alonzo Trier
Trevon Duval
All say hello.
We have had a few of our top 10 guys go undrafted in recent years. Aaron Harrison (#5 in his class), Poythress (#8 in class), Briscoe (#10 in class). It happens.
True enough but you have to admit that there are more strange outcomes at Duke than at UK.Some go un-drafted,some stay too long and some play hurt when they should not. If a kid, or his handlers, take a hard look at Duke and K why would you go there if you have the other options these kids have.
K teaches a system,not everyone fits his system.
Very true. On top of that, he tries to fit players to his system, not the other way around and I think that’s why some of those guys struggle sometimes. It’s a square peg in a round hole type of thing. Of course duke still has lots of guys drafted as well and K wins a ton of games. He’s a great coach. BUT, maybe I’m wrong, but it seems to me like Cal does a better job of showcasing guys talents and taking 4 stars and making them lottery picks. Bledsoe, booker and now Shai were all ranked outside of the elite of their high school classes (not sure but I think they were all outside the top 20) and all were lottery picks. I think that’s awfully impressive. I haven’t looked in depth at that, but I don’t remember seeing other blueblood programs doing that, on top of the already sure fire lottery picks in the same recruiting classes. Obviously Anthony Davis was going top 5 no matter where he went, but to say the 3 I mentioned were too is a stretch. People have to give Cal credit for developing those guys.
Mo Bamba screwed himself as well.. He would of been top 2 if he went to UK
Here is my struggle with this line of thinking.
Since 2009 (Cal's first year at UK), Duke has had 11 top 10 recruits sign with them. All 11 left after 1 year. 1 of them went undrafted.
In the same time frame, UK has had 21 top 10 recruits. 16 left after 1 year. 2 of them went undrafted.
THANK YOU ! I FREAKING HATE WHEN PEOPLE SAY THAT NONSENSE.
I don't know about that but he would of been more ready for the NBA. Same with Zion. Zion might still go top 5 but if he had come to UK instead of Duke he would be more ready for the NBA .
The accuracy of this hurts. I think I'm beyond objectifying CBB programs based on NBA potential and draft picks. I care way more about winning championships than I do boasting about what we contribute to the NBA. For some reason that sentiment is offensive to a lot of people on this site.
Cal adapts each season, to fit the team he has. Coach K thinks he is God, so he uses the same system regardless of the players. I still think K is a great coach (I hate him) but he does get results. However, I think Cal doesn't get all the credit he deserves. I hope he stays awhile and builds his legacy. I don't see him going back to the NBA. I feel if he stays, he could be almost as big a legend as Rupp.
You shouldn’t have to struggle. Just treat K and Cal the same. For example, the horseshit that Cal’s players would have been top NBA players no matter where they played. That is never said about K.
[roll]
I ******* love this. This tells me all I need to know about the UK/Duke comparison and the Cal/K comparison. It should tell everyone all they need to know, IMO. Again, [roll]
I ******* love this. This tells me all I need to know about the UK/Duke comparison and the Cal/K comparison. It should tell everyone all they need to know, IMO. Again, [roll]
Right. The double standard on display last night was nauseating. It was said of Carter and Bagley multiple times, “going to Duke really paid off for them.” Several months earlier when someone pointed out how many draft picks Cal had produced, Bilas interjected, “He hasn’t produced them, he has recruited them.”
If people don’t want to believe a coach can have any impact on a player’s draft pick, they’re idiots, but they’re free to believe that. But they need to at least be consistent. If Cal doesn’t get any credit for his lottery picks, neither should Koach Krybaby.
Just looking at the numbers,they are about doubled 11 vs 21 and 1 vs 2 going un-drafted(yes 10 vs 16 is less than 2 to 1 but still significantly different numbers)
Going one step more ,Cal player success vs K player success rate tells much the same story.
Nonsense,I've not yet begun(or in the famous words of Mark Stoops I'm just getting started bro)
I told you, you begun...are you begunning again? You did with that guy...
The only thing that kept Bamba from going higher is he has a very low motor at times. Shaka let it go. Cal would not have. Cal would've been much better for him.
I would remove Poythress from that list. He was a Senior and had no choice to leave. Yea he went undrafted, but just because they are a top 10 player does not mean they are draftable.
Hell, how many great college players flame out in the NBA. Some players look amazing in HS/College and can't make it in the pros.
People like Harrison and Briscoe were never going to work out in the NBA and that is what frustrates me when they leave knowing this. Those type of guys annoy me and it's a flaw in Cal's system. I love Cal, but that part sucks (Wenyen this year).
Someone like Williams might be better off with a franchise like the Celtics who don't need him to shoulder the load.. as opposed to going to say Atlanta where all the responsibility is on him.
It'll be hard to get back all the money he missed out on by coming back.. but it's not out of the realm that he could pull it off over the long haul.
What strange outcomes have their been at Duke besides this year?
UK has had a lot more players leave "for the draft" and not get drafted than Duke has.
I think a better argument about UK vs Duke is all the "can't miss prospects" at Duke vs UK. UK gets them taken above where the mock drafts say before the season starts and at Duke, they usually slip. A perfect example of that is Jahlil Okafor vs KAT and Bagley being touted as the next big thing and losing his #1 spot.
You mention OKafor,Allen probably should have gone before he did and the list of point guards who have under preformed there is greater than it should be.
Duke should have won it all this season as much as UK should have won it all with the 38-1 team.My point is K gets no more (and probably less) mileage out of his top recruits than does Cal(even with all the help K gets from the media and the refs)
I think I am fairly objective(even though I dislike Duke)Cal should have at least 2 more titles than he does,but he(Cal) prepares his players for the NBA better than K.They are more ready when they get there
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Poythress had a come out fresh year he would have been a first rounder. Blew a knee and I think he is still with the Pacers association. Thing is none of those guys were ever on draft boards going into their Freshmen season. Duval was projected to go top ten in the draft preseason. Truth is Duval goes to UK he gets drafted first round.
Kentucky has been doing 1AD for twice as long as Duke. That skews the numbers. Despite that, it's roughly the same amount of transfers (outgoing) between them during that time.
That doesn't seem likely to me,but I wonder how much attention the NBA folks pay to K? Who do they (NBA folks) put the most stock in K or Cal?
I'm not so sure about your numbers there. Who are the 2 top-10 players to leave after 1 year that went undrafted?
According to every credible source every single one of Cal's one-and-done players had been drafted in the first round until last night when Vanderbilt went in the second round.
Just proves that Cal is light years ahead of every coach when it comes to the OAD.
Zion is trouble, mark my words. I am glad we didn’t get him.
I was speaking top 10 recruits in general not being drafted when they left UK, regardless of year (Poythress and Briscoe). I might have made a mistake not including Harrison.
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None of those players left after one year. That is specifically what you said, top-10 players to leave after one year.