Clemson & Southern Schools - Out Of State Admissions

[fatpiggy]

What is it about the Souths colleges that makes it so everyone wants to come here? You have the Fagnars of the world who stereotype us as dumb hillbillies, yet everyone wants to come here.

SC is one of the most moved to state, if not the #1 moved to state. We can’t keep the Yankees out of our schools.

Just don’t forget what you left when it comes time to vote.

On a serious note, Clemson should be for the people of SC and the number of out of staters is too high. I know we have sold our soul to the debt devil though. Jury is still out on Clements.

 

[RockyMtNole]

A lot of them are fairly cheap for out of state, and they give significant tuition breaks to good students.

 

[Flie_rivals154594]

There's a dude going to FSU that has an ongoing video series about this. He was accepted into multiple ivy league schools but chose FSU. His philosophy is that the outcome won't be much different (career-wise) but the experience will be significantly easier/better since he has an ivy league brain but is going to a public school in the south. More fun, less difficult, cheaper.

 

[NorthernHawkeye]

There's a dude going to FSU that has an ongoing video series about this. He was accepted into multiple ivy league schools but chose FSU. His philosophy is that the outcome won't be much different (career-wise) but the experience will be significantly easier/better since he has an ivy league brain but is going to a public school in the south. More fun, less difficult, cheaper.

Less difficult?

Ivy League Grade Inflation: Why Is It So Prominent?​

There’s an old saying that seems particularly relevant in our current moment: “It’s really hard to get into the Ivy League, and really easy to graduate from it!” The reason being? Grade inflation!

Full article:

Ivy League Grade Inflation | Ivy Coach

The average GPA across the Ivy League just keeps ascending higher and higher through the years. But changes are coming.

www.ivycoach.com

 

[fatpiggy]

There's a dude going to FSU that has an ongoing video series about this. He was accepted into multiple ivy league schools but chose FSU. His philosophy is that the outcome won't be much different (career-wise) but the experience will be significantly easier/better since he has an ivy league brain but is going to a public school in the south. More fun, less difficult, cheaper.

I would argue the connections at a traditional Ivy League school would be much more valuable than the connections at Fl State. No shade to to Fl State with that, same would go with Clemson.

I do agree that the cost is less, but i think the trends are a lot to due to the rancid covid policies instituted by a lot of the northern, democrat goverened, schools. Mandated vaccines and boosters. Strict lockdowns. Vaccine passports etc. all while SEC Teams were hosting football games with 80,000 people.

And yes the cost of living is also a contributor. High tax northern states like to come to lower tax Southern states.

 

[NorthernHawkeye]

All other things considered equal, I would hire a non ivy grad over an ivy grad.

 

[Flie_rivals154594]

Less difficult?

Ivy League Grade Inflation: Why Is It So Prominent?​

There’s an old saying that seems particularly relevant in our current moment: “It’s really hard to get into the Ivy League, and really easy to graduate from it!” The reason being? Grade inflation!

Full article:

Ivy League Grade Inflation | Ivy Coach

The average GPA across the Ivy League just keeps ascending higher and higher through the years. But changes are coming.

www.ivycoach.com

I'm not the guy making the videos. He also meant that FSU was less difficult than the Ivy League schools.

 

[Palmerhawk]

At University of Iowa up to 40% of the undergrad comes from illinois.

1. U of illinois is hard to get into due to in-state population and hence demand.
2. Iowa out of state tuition is cheaper than instate at U if illinois.
3. It's in the BIG.

Out of state demand is a good thing.

 

[Flie_rivals154594]

I would argue the connections at a traditional Ivy League school would be much more valuable than the connections at Fl State. No shade to to Fl State with that, same would go with Clemson.

I do agree that the cost is less, but i think the trends are a lot to due to the rancid covid policies instituted by a lot of the northern, democrat goverened, schools. Mandated vaccines and boosters. Strict lockdowns. Vaccine passports etc. all while SEC Teams were hosting football games with 80,000 people.

And yes the cost of living is also a contributor. High tax northern states like to come to lower tax Southern states.

The Ivy League education and outcome will be better in most cases. I don't make the videos but found them interesting.

 

[fatpiggy]

At University of Iowa up to 40% of the undergrad comes from illinois.

1. U of illinois is hard to get into due to in-state population and hence demand.
2. Iowa out of state tuition is cheaper than instate at U if illinois.
3. It's in the BIG.

Out of state demand is a good thing.

Iowa also borders Illinois. Not quite the same as New Yorkers and New Jerseyians coming to Clemson and Fl State. How many people come to Iowa, say from California or Oregon, and has there been a large increase since 2020? That would be a more apples to apples comparison.

Out of state demand is a good thing, it means your school is desirable. But that doesn't mean you need to take out of state students. Im arguing that Clemson should have a state law mandating a certain percentage of in state students. It is a State school afterall, it should primarily serve the citizens of the state.

Those of us in SC are very familiar with the state laws of NC which mandate a certain percentage.

 

[scotchtiger]

There's a dude going to FSU that has an ongoing video series about this. He was accepted into multiple ivy league schools but chose FSU. His philosophy is that the outcome won't be much different (career-wise) but the experience will be significantly easier/better since he has an ivy league brain but is going to a public school in the south. More fun, less difficult, cheaper.

I would say there’s merit in going to a more “normal” school for undergrad and then getting the big name MBA. I see more of that in high level roles in my industry. And you’re more prepared for the school’s placement network for jobs in IB, big 3 consulting, etc. You also get the “normal” college experience which is good for your development in other areas.

 

[Tenacious E_rivals41982]

I would argue the connections at a traditional Ivy League school would be much more valuable than the connections at Fl State. No shade to to Fl State with that, same would go with Clemson.

I do agree that the cost is less, but i think the trends are a lot to due to the rancid covid policies instituted by a lot of the northern, democrat goverened, schools. Mandated vaccines and boosters. Strict lockdowns. Vaccine passports etc. all while SEC Teams were hosting football games with 80,000 people.

And yes the cost of living is also a contributor. High tax northern states like to come to lower tax Southern states.

You think incoming freshmen from the north care about what South Carolina did 5 or 6 years ago with Covid policy when they were 11 or 12? I don’t. I would surmise the people going there do it primarily for the weather. I do agree with you on the Ivy League schools though. The value is the prestige of getting accepted, and then making connections to connected people.

 

[Urohawk]

Southern schools have warm weather and scantily clad coeds. Have you survived a winter in Chicago? That being said I would never attend any of those schools outside of Florida, Clemson, or GT. We have a lot of people got to Alabama or Arkansas from Kansas and it's mostly to party. I don't hold their degree in high regards and the graduates that we run into from some of those schools don't perform as well. Generally, I have less bias if you grew up in the state where you attended college. For example, if you're from Mississippi and went to Ole Miss it's not as big of a deal if you're from Illinois and went to Ole Miss.

 

[coldbud1994]

Clemson has been about a 60%/40% split between in-state and out of state. The out of state kids are generally high achievers and pay $$

 

[fatpiggy]

You think incoming freshmen from the north care about what South Carolina did 5 or 6 years ago with Covid policy when they were 11 or 12? I don’t. I would surmise the people going there do it primarily for the weather. I do agree with you on the Ivy League schools though. The value is the prestige of getting accepted, and then making connections to connected people.

I don't think covid policy is the only reason. I think the cost of living is the major reason. The cost of out of state tuition for them is cheaper than a most of the NY private school tuitions.

I joke around about the yankees and stuff. But in all seriousness, I do think State schools should primarily serve their constituents. I think NC has it right on this particular point.

 

[RockyMtNole]

Southern schools have warm weather and scantily clad coeds. Have you survived a winter in Chicago? That being said I would never attend any of those schools outside of Florida, Clemson, or GT. We have a lot of people got to Alabama or Arkansas from Kansas and it's mostly to party. I don't hold their degree in high regards and the graduates that we run into from some of those schools don't perform as well. Generally, I have less bias if you grew up in the state where you attended college. For example, if you're from Mississippi and went to Ole Miss it's not as big of a deal if you're from Illinois and went to Ole Miss.

We have had some kids around here go to Alabama - football, partying, sorority stuff, and of course the massive scholarships.

I think the issue is most who do that have no intention of staying in Alabama or Mississippi (and why would you?) so the issue you raise comes into play. I have heard anecdotally that some kids my son knows who have come back after graduation from southern schools have had more difficult time finding work.

 

[Tenacious E_rivals41982]

I don't think covid policy is the only reason. I think the cost of living is the major reason. The cost of out of state tuition for them is cheaper than a most of the NY private school tuitions.

I joke around about the yankees and stuff. But in all seriousness, I do think State schools should primarily serve their constituents. I think NC has it right on this particular point.

I feel the same way about Iowa. We Iowans pay taxes that support the state schools and their first priority should be to educate Iowans. For the most part, I feel like Iowa has supported that priority. It is very easy to get into if you are from Iowa given you can get an auto-admit based on a formula that is fairly easy to satisfy if you did well in high school, or did well on the ACT. You don't need both here. Do SC state schools have the same kind of admissions process?

 

[hawkeyetraveler]

At University of Iowa up to 40% of the undergrad comes from illinois.

1. U of illinois is hard to get into due to in-state population and hence demand.
2. Iowa out of state tuition is cheaper than instate at U if illinois.
3. It's in the BIG.

Out of state demand is a good thing.

20 year old me says: thank God for that. I had a LOT of fun with coeds from the Chicago suburbs in my time at Iowa. Eventually married (and divorced ) one such young woman.

 

[dgordo]

Southern schools are heavily recruiting students from the Chicago suburbs with huge amounts of scholarships and many schools are easier to get into than Illinois, Wisconsin, Indiana and Michigan State.
If you are a B student from Naperville it’s easier to get into Alabama or ole miss and it’s less expensive.

 

[SB_SB]

I believe Alabama give free tuition for certain ACT scores.

 

[hawkeyetraveler]

As others mentioned I wonder about the jobs aspect of this. Networking is a massive part of getting jobs after college and having certain affiliations (like being an Illinois grad in Chicago) makes that much easier. There just aren’t a lot of Alabama grads in this area that would be predisposed to hire another Alabama grad. And lots of kids end up coming back to the area after college because of family/friends/familiarity.

 

[GesterHawk]

Iowa also borders Illinois. Not quite the same as New Yorkers and New Jerseyians coming to Clemson and Fl State. How many people come to Iowa, say from California or Oregon, and has there been a large increase since 2020? That would be a more apples to apples comparison.

Out of state demand is a good thing, it means your school is desirable. But that doesn't mean you need to take out of state students. Im arguing that Clemson should have a state law mandating a certain percentage of in state students. It is a State school afterall, it should primarily serve the citizens of the state.

Those of us in SC are very familiar with the state laws of NC which mandate a certain percentage.

I rented an apartment with a guy from Connecticut for a year, there was a dude on my floor freshman year from AZ.
All the girls I knew on the field hockey team came from the East Coast.

Out of state tuition also will often subsidize the tuition for in state students. All those kids from the Chicago suburbs pay almost twice as much as the Iowa kids.

I believe all the Iowa public universities have guaranteed admission for Iowa kids if they meet the admission threshold. I'd be surprised if other states (not all but most) didn't have something similar.

 

[AFM22]

At University of Iowa up to 40% of the undergrad comes from illinois.

1. U of illinois is hard to get into due to in-state population and hence demand.
2. Iowa out of state tuition is cheaper than instate at U if illinois.
3. It's in the BIG.

Out of state demand is a good thing.

I don't necessarily think number 2 is true.

From both school's websites

 

[SB_SB]

As others mentioned I wonder about the jobs aspect of this. Networking is a massive part of getting jobs after college and having certain affiliations (like being an Illinois grad in Chicago) makes that much easier. There just aren’t a lot of Alabama grads in this area that would be predisposed to hire another Alabama grad. And lots of kids end up coming back to the area after college because of family/friends/familiarity.

Honestly, I'm not sure how much the college comes into play anymore. In the tech world (which you probably have your own perspective), I don't think people care one bit about which college and at times, even which degree. And the main reason is, the people hiring don't even have the skills to do the job they're hiring for. I'm in FinTech and we're back to the philosophy of a manager doesn't have to know what he's managing. Even senior leadership doesn't have to know technology to make technical decision. This seems to cycle every 2-5 years.

 

[scotchtiger]

We have had some kids around here go to Alabama - football, partying, sorority stuff, and of course the massive scholarships.

I think the issue is most who do that have no intention of staying in Alabama or Mississippi (and why would you?) so the issue you raise comes into play. I have heard anecdotally that some kids my son knows who have come back after graduation from southern schools have had more difficult time finding work.

Yep. I will encourage my boys to go to Clemson unless they have materially better options out of state. Going out of state to Alabama or FSU or something if they get into Clemson doesn’t make sense. They are 6th generation Charlestonians, so odds are they end up living here and the local network is stronger.

Now if they get into and want to go to a Vandy/Emory/Duke/etc type school, that’s fine. Though I would still suggest Clemson is a good undergrad option and then I’ll pay for those places for grad school.

If they don’t get into Clemson, that’s a different story. SCar sucks. Columbia is terrible and the academics aren’t good. Tougher decisions then.

 

[Tenacious E_rivals41982]

Yep. I will encourage my boys to go to Clemson unless they have materially better options out of state. Going out of state to Alabama or FSU or something if they get into Clemson doesn’t make sense. They are 6th generation Charlestonians, so odds are they end up living here and the local network is stronger.

Now if they get into and want to go to a Vandy/Emory/Duke/etc type school, that’s fine. Though I would still suggest Clemson is a good undergrad option and then I’ll pay for those places for grad school.

If they don’t get into Clemson, that’s a different story. SCar sucks. Columbia is terrible and the academics aren’t good. Tougher decisions then.

I felt the same way with my kids and Iowa. It is a good school and it's degree is strongest in Iowa, but it works well in the midwest too. While I didn't tell my kids they couldn't go to out of state schools, I said they need to make a case for one, other than weather. Neither of them did, so I am dodging some big bullets I could have been hit with putting them through different schools. I also share your opinion on grad/professional school, should they go that route. That school matters a lot more than your undergrad school, so you might as well go the cheaper route for undergrad.

 

[Jfcarter3]

What is it about the Souths colleges that makes it so everyone wants to come here? You have the Fagnars of the world who stereotype us as dumb hillbillies, yet everyone wants to come here.

SC is one of the most moved to state, if not the #1 moved to state. We can’t keep the Yankees out of our schools.

Just don’t forget what you left when it comes time to vote.

On a serious note, Clemson should be for the people of SC and the number of out of staters is too high. I know we have sold our soul to the debt devil though. Jury is still out on Clements.

Except no one wants to go to starkvegas. Still.

 

[MTTiger19]

Iowa also borders Illinois. Not quite the same as New Yorkers and New Jerseyians coming to Clemson and Fl State. How many people come to Iowa, say from California or Oregon, and has there been a large increase since 2020? That would be a more apples to apples comparison.

Out of state demand is a good thing, it means your school is desirable. But that doesn't mean you need to take out of state students. Im arguing that Clemson should have a state law mandating a certain percentage of in state students. It is a State school afterall, it should primarily serve the citizens of the state.

Those of us in SC are very familiar with the state laws of NC which mandate a certain percentage.

No one goes to Iowa for anything ever. That lily white cornfield is calling no one’s name. There’s a reason our board is littered with Iowans. Their state doesn’t even have a message board lol.

 

[yoshi121374]

I would argue the connections at a traditional Ivy League school would be much more valuable than the connections at Fl State. No shade to to Fl State with that, same would go with Clemson.

I do agree that the cost is less, but i think the trends are a lot to due to the rancid covid policies instituted by a lot of the northern, democrat goverened, schools. Mandated vaccines and boosters. Strict lockdowns. Vaccine passports etc. all while SEC Teams were hosting football games with 80,000 people.

And yes the cost of living is also a contributor. High tax northern states like to come to lower tax Southern states.

Imagine thinking kids today who were 12 during COVID are choosing college based on politics. Continue to be a clueless self inflated chud Fatpiggy.

 

[Moogy]

What is it about the Souths colleges that makes it so everyone wants to come here? You have the Fagnars of the world who stereotype us as dumb hillbillies, yet everyone wants to come here.

SC is one of the most moved to state, if not the #1 moved to state. We can’t keep the Yankees out of our schools.

Just don’t forget what you left when it comes time to vote.

On a serious note, Clemson should be for the people of SC and the number of out of staters is too high. I know we have sold our soul to the debt devil though. Jury is still out on Clements.

My older son's graduating class saw 2 kids decide to go to Clemson ... neither of them were very bright, nor were they high achievers. One is a partier, the other some weird, hard to figure out kid, who used to be a top athlete and pretty good student, but just kind of fizzled out in both respects. I talked to the dad of one of the kids and asked him "why Clemson?" He said that the kid just got it in his head he wanted to go South, and he applied to a bunch of cheap schools down there ... he really wanted to go to Auburn, but didn't get in ... Clemson was the only one that took him.

No one from that graduating class is attending FSU, as far as I know (or Iowa, since that's another college of note on this board, even if it isn't southern). One is going to Univ of Florida, in their Honors College.

My understanding is that kids from up north go the southern state school route because they're cheap, easy to get into and give money ... and they like the weather, and are attracted to the "sports buzz."

 

[SB_SB]

Yep. I will encourage my boys to go to Clemson unless they have materially better options out of state. Going out of state to Alabama or FSU or something if they get into Clemson doesn’t make sense. They are 6th generation Charlestonians, so odds are they end up living here and the local network is stronger.

Now if they get into and want to go to a Vandy/Emory/Duke/etc type school, that’s fine. Though I would still suggest Clemson is a good undergrad option and then I’ll pay for those places for grad school.

If they don’t get into Clemson, that’s a different story. SCar sucks. Columbia is terrible and the academics aren’t good. Tougher decisions then.

When it comes to grad school, some majors at some schools will provide jobs so the student get free tuition and even a stipend. My son went to grad school for free, although he missed out on about 6 years of missed salary, so it's not totally free in the end.

 

[hawkeyetraveler]

No one goes to Iowa for anything ever. That lily white cornfield is calling no one’s name. There’s a reason our board is littered with Iowans. Their state doesn’t even have a message board lol.

 

[MTTiger19]

Black population of Iowa is 3% bro. Lily. White. Zero diversity. Tracks lol.

 

[SB_SB]

No one goes to Iowa for anything ever. That lily white cornfield is calling no one’s name. There’s a reason our board is littered with Iowans. Their state doesn’t even have a message board lol.

Opposites attract. We were posters in need of a message board, while you were a message board desperately in need of posters.

 

[hawkeyetraveler]

Black population of Iowa is 3% bro. Lily. White. Zero diversity. Tracks lol.

Keep throwing chum in those waters…someone will bite

 

[SB_SB]

Black population of Iowa is 3% bro. Lily. White. Zero diversity. Tracks lol.

Does it always have to be a Black/White thing. The Iowa diversity is intelligence and it's about a 50/50 split.

 

[MTTiger19]

Does it always have to be a Black/White thing. The Iowa diversity is intelligence and it's about a 50/50 split.

Touché

 

[GesterHawk]

I felt the same way with my kids and Iowa. It is a good school and it's degree is strongest in Iowa, but it works well in the midwest too. While I didn't tell my kids they couldn't go to out of state schools, I said they need to make a case for one, other than weather. Neither of them did, so I am dodging some big bullets I could have been hit with putting them through different schools. I also share your opinion on grad/professional school, should they go that route. That school matters a lot more than your undergrad school, so you might as well go the cheaper route for undergrad.

I am actually encouraging my kids to go to a school out of the region as long as they are going to a school that has a good program for what the want to study.

I want them to experience life away from where they grew up. I want the to experience more of what our great country has to offer. I want the to grow and learn from different perspectives.

 

[Tenacious E_rivals41982]

I am actually encouraging my kids to go to a school out of the region as long as they are going to a school that has a good program for what the want to study.

I want them to experience life away from where they grew up. I want the to experience more of what our great country has to offer. I want the to grow and learn from different perspectives.

I can appreciate that. My hope is that our travel to other parts of the country and world have broadened their horizons.

 

[GesterHawk]

I can appreciate that. My hope is that our travel to other parts of the country and world have broadened their horizons.

There are different approaches to some of the same goals.

Selfishly, I am hoping by leaving the region that my kids settle down somewhere different than home so that eventually the No Pics and I get to choose a fun place close to them that we can retire at.