Amari and Koby struggled to produce anything last year and Otega is really struggling today, I know they arent the caliber of talent we usually pump out but I thought they would provide some more I reckon.
Why do Pope products really seem to struggle in the NBA
- Thread starter Anon200440
- Start date
You can’t be serious. You thought fringe second rounders and undrafted free agents were going to make the all-Rookie team?
Idk maybe revisit a topic like this when there is an actual sample size to draw inferences from.
Idk maybe revisit a topic like this when there is an actual sample size to draw inferences from.
Second rounders are not expected to make big impacts as rookies. Sure, there’s a small percentage of them that contribute year one but not many. I’d bet if you go look at the all-rookie teams over the last ten years, 25% or less of them are 2nd rounders. I could be wrong but I bet it checks out. Your expectations are just far too elevated for the circumstances.
All id like for any of the pope guys to avg is like 5-7 ppg and have a handful of 20+ ppg games, but a guy that plays every game
Just to give me something to get excited ab
I reject your premise. Amari and Brea massively overachieved just by reaching the NBA, considering they started out their college careers as low rated mid major prospects who were never expected to reach that level at all. What more were you expecting out of mere second round picks in their very first season as pros?
Rather than claiming they “struggled” (and implying Pope has something to do with it), they should be praised for defying expectations by reaching the world’s highest level.
Rather than claiming they “struggled” (and implying Pope has something to do with it), they should be praised for defying expectations by reaching the world’s highest level.
Amari has played pretty well, I haven’t followed Brea much. I think OO could be good, but you can’t judge off one game. Remember that Anthony Bennett looked like a summer world beater and many guys do each year before doing nothings
Ok. OP…take this with a grain of salt. I don’t have the time to do a full search right now but I will later.
so for now you get AI slop
ChatGPT says 87% of the players on the all-rookie teams for the last ten years are first rounders. That gives you an idea of just how rare it is for 2nd rounders to live up to more than support players
87%.
I counted the last 10 NBA All-Rookie teams as 2016-17 through 2025-26, using both First Team and Second Team. That gives 100 total All-Rookie selections. NBA.com’s year-by-year All-Rookie list covers those seasons through the 2025-26 team.
Total: 87 first-rounders out of 100 All-Rookie selections.
Calculation: 87 ÷ 100 = 87%.
For the recent draft-status checks: NBA.com’s draft result pages identify the relevant first-round/second-round picks for 2025, 2024, 2023, 2022, 2021, 2020 and 2019, including Maxime Raynaud at No. 42, Jaylen Wells at No. 39, GG Jackson II at No. 45, Herbert Jones at No. 35, Ayo Dosunmu at No. 38, and Eric Paschall at No. 41.
so for now you get AI slop
ChatGPT says 87% of the players on the all-rookie teams for the last ten years are first rounders. That gives you an idea of just how rare it is for 2nd rounders to live up to more than support players
87%.
I counted the last 10 NBA All-Rookie teams as 2016-17 through 2025-26, using both First Team and Second Team. That gives 100 total All-Rookie selections. NBA.com’s year-by-year All-Rookie list covers those seasons through the 2025-26 team.
| Season | First-round picks | Non-first-round All-Rookie players |
| 2025-26 | 9/10 | Maxime Raynaud, pick 42 |
| 2024-25 | 9/10 | Jaylen Wells, pick 39 |
| 2023-24 | 9/10 | GG Jackson II, pick 45 |
| 2022-23 | 10/10 | None |
| 2021-22 | 8/10 | Herbert Jones, pick 35; Ayo Dosunmu, pick 38 |
| 2020-21 | 9/10 | Jae’Sean Tate, undrafted |
| 2019-20 | 7/10 | Kendrick Nunn, undrafted; Eric Paschall, pick 41; Terence Davis, undrafted |
| 2018-19 | 9/10 | Mitchell Robinson, pick 36 |
| 2017-18 | 10/10 | None |
| 2016-17 | 7/10 | Malcolm Brogdon, pick 36; Willy Hernangomez, pick 35; Yogi Ferrell, undrafted |
Total: 87 first-rounders out of 100 All-Rookie selections.
Calculation: 87 ÷ 100 = 87%.
For the recent draft-status checks: NBA.com’s draft result pages identify the relevant first-round/second-round picks for 2025, 2024, 2023, 2022, 2021, 2020 and 2019, including Maxime Raynaud at No. 42, Jaylen Wells at No. 39, GG Jackson II at No. 45, Herbert Jones at No. 35, Ayo Dosunmu at No. 38, and Eric Paschall at No. 41.
True but we have a large sample size of 2nd rounders under pope so surely one of them booms they cant all be career 2ppg guys surely
Listen man. Your logic is way off on this. So far, Pope’s players in the league, which is a small sample size coz there’s only one season of NBA basketball to use a sample size, are doing fine. What level of production were you expecting for Amari Williams and Koby Brea in year one?
Well boston LITERALLY had one center and league-wide he would be considered below average so Amari had plenty of room to step up
Koby played on a bench squad where he shouldve easily got 10-12 mins a game but never did.
I think both of those are ridiculous points
First, Boston literally had more than one center and both were naturally ahead of a 46th pick in his first year
2025-26 Boston Celtics Roster and Stats | Basketball-Reference.com
Checkout the latest Boston Celtics Roster and Stats for 2025-26 on Basketball-Reference.com
www.basketball-reference.com
And Koby Brea wasn’t going to log many minutes in PHX. They were strongest at wing.
2025-26 Phoenix Suns Roster and Stats | Basketball-Reference.com
Checkout the latest Phoenix Suns Roster and Stats for 2025-26 on Basketball-Reference.com
www.basketball-reference.com
Brea played pretty well in the sample of time he was given. Made 43.3% of his threes. He did fine for a 41st pick as a rookie.
Amari would be incredible if he only had even a somewhat respectable jumper.
That said, other than shooting Pope's offense in no way works on or highlights the nba skillset. Handles, creating your own shot, etc are just not part of this offense so it isnt a focus.
I know a poster mentioned oo but he has a handle that will get exposed. He can only be a 3 and D till that gets fixed. Pope's offense did a great job covering it up by giving him angles where he could go downhill hard with the right hand.
That said, other than shooting Pope's offense in no way works on or highlights the nba skillset. Handles, creating your own shot, etc are just not part of this offense so it isnt a focus.
I know a poster mentioned oo but he has a handle that will get exposed. He can only be a 3 and D till that gets fixed. Pope's offense did a great job covering it up by giving him angles where he could go downhill hard with the right hand.
Pope has no legit nbaers
The guy has no connections he’s built a few while at UK but no where near what it takes to win. And he has an aversion to building strong relationships with guys like shai, towns, davis on and on. Those should have been his first recruits. That’s how UNC did it. They had MJ through multiple coaches he calls on sometimes visits their top targets. We should have all hands off on deck. Bring these guys into our active alum fold. Guys who recognize what we bBN did for them. Cal didn’t give these guys the stage. We did and they know it. We should have seen pope behind the Knicks bench. Sure the ticket probably cost 75 grand but towns knowing pope dished out to support him is invaluable. What cal did with the 1 and done the players he brought we need a coach who will connect with them. There you go solved it for you mark. Better than hiring assistants to try to lure stokes. A call from shai he wouldn’t tell him no.
The guy has no connections he’s built a few while at UK but no where near what it takes to win. And he has an aversion to building strong relationships with guys like shai, towns, davis on and on. Those should have been his first recruits. That’s how UNC did it. They had MJ through multiple coaches he calls on sometimes visits their top targets. We should have all hands off on deck. Bring these guys into our active alum fold. Guys who recognize what we bBN did for them. Cal didn’t give these guys the stage. We did and they know it. We should have seen pope behind the Knicks bench. Sure the ticket probably cost 75 grand but towns knowing pope dished out to support him is invaluable. What cal did with the 1 and done the players he brought we need a coach who will connect with them. There you go solved it for you mark. Better than hiring assistants to try to lure stokes. A call from shai he wouldn’t tell him no.
Really? This is your concern? Just stop the nonsense.
They are same player after they get coached by Pope that they were before.
So Pope really has nothing to do with it.
So Pope really has nothing to do with it.
The trolls are down to seeds and stems.
If this is the best they can do to try to stir up negativity that’s actually a great sign that Pope is doing things right.
If this is the best they can do to try to stir up negativity that’s actually a great sign that Pope is doing things right.
Some of our fans are catastrophists. It's like fingernails on a chalkboard.
Because he has rarely if ever gotten top talent to play for him in college? This really needs to be explained to you?
Right. I’m like…which draft picks has he produced that actually had expectations?
The fact that Amari was on the Celtics playoff roster was an accomplishment tbh.
Brea is a great shooter and that’s important but he still had a long way to go before his defense was good enough to warrant any kind of playing time at that level.
if you see a anon OP posting some kind of mud about UK, do us all a favor and ignore the trolls. That is all they are...