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Uncoach

Heisman
Dec 8, 2011
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Proof that bad policies don’t impact the rich as much as they hurt the middle and lower class people.

 
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rillaman

Heisman
May 10, 2009
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So how does it compute that the jab actually saved lives, if the odds of death increased?



Older, sicker people were more likely to get the vaccine/boosters. Older, sicker people are more likely to die.

5 years later and people still don’t understand the basics.

You should show that clip to your doctor and then ask them if you have an increased chance at death because of your vaccine from 5 years ago. Then report back please.
 
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stoneaxe27

All-American
Sep 22, 2006
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Medicaid?
Very limited, especially now. Must fit a category and limited income and no assets. Less than $3,000 per month income limit for family of 3. Health care outcomes higher where there is Universal Medical (God forbid we call it socialized medicine) Infant mortality in US is much higher than in those countries.
 

rillaman

Heisman
May 10, 2009
18,531
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Very limited, especially now. Must fit a category and limited income and no assets. Less than $3,000 per month income limit for family of 3. Health care outcomes higher where there is Universal Medical (God forbid we call it socialized medicine) Infant mortality in US is much higher than in those countries.

Sure, but we don’t just let people die. If somenone is rushed to the ER with a gunshot wound, we treat them regardless of them having insurance coverage or not. We don’t just let them die, as you said.

Tough to offer socialized medicine in our country when Democrats want to offer it to the entire world. That doesn’t work financially, without taxing everyone at an insane level.
 

AzIllini

Senior
Apr 26, 2003
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“from ALL causes”
Those are the key words. ChatGPT says there is no reliable study showing 23% and it doesn't make sense. The vaccine had many issues and side effects but how can you do a population study of statistical significance after 5 years that shows that the group who got the vaccine are dying at a rate 23% higher than those that didn't. What it probably shows is older vaccinated people died at a much higher rate than younger people who refused the vaccine. Older people do die at a higher rate.

What is sad is all this noise takes away from the forced vaccinations the Dems forced on people. This is the lesson we need to learn and avoid in the future. A voluntary vaccine was OK for 65 and older; people forget the fear in 2020. But never, ever force it on people involuntarily like the Dems did. And Gavin Newsome wants to be our next president....
 

Uncoach

Heisman
Dec 8, 2011
6,903
10,095
113
This is an example of people coming here for the wrong reasons. I have nothing against immigrants, but Somalia was ***. That’s why you supposedly came here.

 

Uncoach

Heisman
Dec 8, 2011
6,903
10,095
113
Those are the key words. ChatGPT says there is no reliable study showing 23% and it doesn't make sense. The vaccine had many issues and side effects but how can you do a population study of statistical significance after 5 years that shows that the group who got the vaccine are dying at a rate 23% higher than those that didn't. What it probably shows is older vaccinated people died at a much higher rate than younger people who refused the vaccine. Older people do die at a higher rate.

What is sad is all this noise takes away from the forced vaccinations the Dems forced on people. This is the lesson we need to learn and avoid in the future. A voluntary vaccine was OK for 65 and older; people forget the fear in 2020. But never, ever force it on people involuntarily like the Dems did. And Gavin Newsome wants to be our next president....
You could be right. I avoid ChatGPT. Most AI are programmed to leftist views.
 

dtrain79

Heisman
Jul 13, 2006
48,654
27,597
113
So how does it compute that the jab actually saved lives, if the odds of death increased?



The audience for this take is you, Dumbcoach. If the average person taking the vaccine is 56 and the average person not taking it is 38 (and it’s undeniable that takers skewed older), then the non-vaccine takers are less likely to die because … young people are less likely to die. How about that???

RFK thinks you are an idiot because he doesn’t think you can figure this out.

Now, actual science would compare people of the same age and general health taking it and their outcomes. Oh … we have these studies … I’ve linked them … the vaccinated died at lower rates.

Weird how he relies on your stupidity to make arguments.
 
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dtrain79

Heisman
Jul 13, 2006
48,654
27,597
113
Those are the key words. ChatGPT says there is no reliable study showing 23% and it doesn't make sense. The vaccine had many issues and side effects but how can you do a population study of statistical significance after 5 years that shows that the group who got the vaccine are dying at a rate 23% higher than those that didn't. What it probably shows is older vaccinated people died at a much higher rate than younger people who refused the vaccine. Older people do die at a higher rate.

What is sad is all this noise takes away from the forced vaccinations the Dems forced on people. This is the lesson we need to learn and avoid in the future. A voluntary vaccine was OK for 65 and older; people forget the fear in 2020. But never, ever force it on people involuntarily like the Dems did. And Gavin Newsome wants to be our next president....

Thank you for injecting rational thought into this discussion.
 

stoneaxe27

All-American
Sep 22, 2006
5,709
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Sure, but we don’t just let people die. If somenone is rushed to the ER with a gunshot wound, we treat them regardless of them having insurance coverage or not. We don’t just let them die, as you said.

Tough to offer socialized medicine in our country when Democrats want to offer it to the entire world. That doesn’t work financially, without taxing everyone at an insane level.
Gun shot wound isn't the issue LOL. The Emergency Rooms have to provide Emergency Care. But if one goes in with symptoms that are not life threatening, an illness or just symptoms, they are told they can not be admitted until their life is threatened. When they wait a year or two and go back, they are terminal. Happens every day.
 

stoneaxe27

All-American
Sep 22, 2006
5,709
6,679
113
Those are the key words. ChatGPT says there is no reliable study showing 23% and it doesn't make sense. The vaccine had many issues and side effects but how can you do a population study of statistical significance after 5 years that shows that the group who got the vaccine are dying at a rate 23% higher than those that didn't. What it probably shows is older vaccinated people died at a much higher rate than younger people who refused the vaccine. Older people do die at a higher rate.

What is sad is all this noise takes away from the forced vaccinations the Dems forced on people. This is the lesson we need to learn and avoid in the future. A voluntary vaccine was OK for 65 and older; people forget the fear in 2020. But never, ever force it on people involuntarily like the Dems did. And Gavin Newsome wants to be our next president....
I can't understand let alone agree with you guys that agree to this anti- vaxx non-sense. It started when I was 2 with the Salk Polio vaccine. To be consistent, you object to the polio vaccine, and think it was acceptable for my parents to risk me being in an iron lung until death. I have been vaccinated every year to be admitted to school, as have all of my kids. You guys object to that. It is called Public Health. I believe in science, you believe in conspiracy nuttiness.
 

rillaman

Heisman
May 10, 2009
18,531
11,727
113
Gun shot wound isn't the issue LOL. The Emergency Rooms have to provide Emergency Care. But if one goes in with symptoms that are not life threatening, an illness or just symptoms, they are told they can not be admitted until their life is threatened. When they wait a year or two and go back, they are terminal. Happens every day.

That’s because unfortunately a lot of people go to the ER when they don’t need to. Typically, they tell those people to go to an urgent care, minute clinic, or PCP (at a much lower cost) to take care of that type of illness or injury. I have that conversation on an almost daily basis when helping employers control their healthcare costs.

You are not wrong in thinking our healthcare system is broken. But I think you are dodging some of the negatives around socialized healthcare too.

There are times where Americans travel to other countries for healthcare. There are times when non Americans come to the US for healthcare. Both systems have their holes.

Trump is actually doing some things that could help in the future. I know some will never give him credit but he is fighting to get costs down for drugs that are cheaper when sourced outside of the country.

Mark Cuban is a good follow on LinkedIn for those interested in seeing why our healthcare system is so broken. He is also trying to make a difference.
 

rillaman

Heisman
May 10, 2009
18,531
11,727
113
I can't understand let alone agree with you guys that agree to this anti- vaxx non-sense. It started when I was 2 with the Salk Polio vaccine. To be consistent, you object to the polio vaccine, and think it was acceptable for my parents to risk me being in an iron lung until death. I have been vaccinated every year to be admitted to school, as have all of my kids. You guys object to that. It is called Public Health. I believe in science, you believe in conspiracy nuttiness.

No, these things are nothing alike. Most of us had already been exposed to COVID and fought it off with little problem.

I haven’t seen anyone on here talking about the polio vaccine.
 

stoneaxe27

All-American
Sep 22, 2006
5,709
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That’s because unfortunately a lot of people go to the ER when they don’t need to. Typically, they tell those people to go to an urgent care, minute clinic, or PCP (at a much lower cost) to take care of that type of illness or injury. I have that conversation on an almost daily basis when helping employers control their healthcare costs.

You are not wrong in thinking our healthcare system is broken. But I think you are dodging some of the negatives around socialized healthcare too.

There are times where Americans travel to other countries for healthcare. There are times when non Americans come to the US for healthcare. Both systems have their holes.

Trump is actually doing some things that could help in the future. I know some will never give him credit but he is fighting to get costs down for drugs that are cheaper when sourced outside of the country.

Mark Cuban is a good follow on LinkedIn for those interested in seeing why our healthcare system is so broken. He is also trying to make a difference.
"Many people go to the emergency room when they do not need to" Yes, that is the problem, THEY HAVE NO OTHER HEALTH CARE!. Emergency room care is the most expensive form of care. Don't try to justify our system. It does not work and needs to be changed.
 

rillaman

Heisman
May 10, 2009
18,531
11,727
113
"Many people go to the emergency room when they do not need to" Yes, that is the problem, THEY HAVE NO OTHER HEALTH CARE!. Emergency room care is the most expensive form of care. Don't try to justify our system. It does not work and needs to be changed.

Many people WITH health insurance go to the ER when they don’t need to. I show this data to employers on a daily basis when they ask why their plans are running so poorly.

Roughly 25% of the ER visits that we see could have been handled at lower cost facilities. Most employers talk to their employees about this during their onboarding and/or open enrollment process.

But yes, uninsured and non citizen visits to the ER are an issue.
 

stoneaxe27

All-American
Sep 22, 2006
5,709
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No, these things are nothing alike. Most of us had already been exposed to COVID and fought it off with little problem.

I haven’t seen anyone on here talking about the polio vaccine.
NOW. When it first hit it was deadly. The world was rightfully panicked. It was comparable to the "Spanish Flu"." Fought it off with little problem" except for those millions that died! JHC, talk about rewriting history for political purposes or lack of recall.
 

rillaman

Heisman
May 10, 2009
18,531
11,727
113
NOW. When it first hit it was deadly. The world was rightfully panicked. It was comparable to the "Spanish Flu"." Fought it off with little problem" except for those millions that died! JHC, talk about rewriting history for political purposes or lack of recall.

We didn’t have the vaccine until a year and a half after it hit. As I said, most of us already had COVID and survived it easily. Meanwhile, people like you had us masking toddlers. Closed parks and beaches but left liquor stores and dispensaries open. That was “public health” and was not to be questioned.

Another reason why people are hesitant to put the govt in charge of our healthcare. They make horrible decisions regularly. And every time the govt gets involved, costs go up.
 

stoneaxe27

All-American
Sep 22, 2006
5,709
6,679
113
We didn’t have the vaccine until a year and a half after it hit. As I said, most of us already had COVID and survived it easily. Meanwhile, people like you had us masking toddlers. Closed parks and beaches but left liquor stores and dispensaries open. That was “public health” and was not to be questioned.

Another reason why people are hesitant to put the govt in charge of our healthcare. They make horrible decisions regularly. And every time the govt gets involved, costs go up.
BS. The vaccine came out about less than a year after it hit. Everyone including Trump tought it was great, I still do. Have no idea why you deep thinkers are still thinking about it 5 years later? ?????Get a life and get off the fixation with masks, and getting a shot 5 years ago. Conspiracy brain!
 

stoneaxe27

All-American
Sep 22, 2006
5,709
6,679
113
We didn’t have the vaccine until a year and a half after it hit. As I said, most of us already had COVID and survived it easily. Meanwhile, people like you had us masking toddlers. Closed parks and beaches but left liquor stores and dispensaries open. That was “public health” and was not to be questioned.

Another reason why people are hesitant to put the govt in charge of our healthcare. They make horrible decisions regularly. And every time the govt gets involved, costs go up.
 

stoneaxe27

All-American
Sep 22, 2006
5,709
6,679
113
We didn’t have the vaccine until a year and a half after it hit. As I said, most of us already had COVID and survived it easily. Meanwhile, people like you had us masking toddlers. Closed parks and beaches but left liquor stores and dispensaries open. That was “public health” and was not to be questioned.

Another reason why people are hesitant to put the govt in charge of our healthcare. They make horrible decisions regularly. And every time the govt gets involved, costs go up.
Oh yeah, I would rather have an insurance company or health care corp. calling the shots, they make good decisions based upon the patient and not saving a buck. The administrative costs of Medicare, government health, is about 5% , private health insurance is about 25%. That is without Google.
 

rillaman

Heisman
May 10, 2009
18,531
11,727
113
Oh yeah, I would rather have an insurance company or health care corp. calling the shots, they make good decisions based upon the patient and not saving a buck. The administrative costs of Medicare, government health, is about 5% , private health insurance is about 25%. That is without Google.

That’s because the govt imposes taxes, regulations, and penalties on private health plans. Of course, they don’t require govt entities to follow those same regulations and requirements. As I said, every time the govt gets involved, private health care costs go up.
 

rillaman

Heisman
May 10, 2009
18,531
11,727
113
BS. The vaccine came out about less than a year after it hit. Everyone including Trump tought it was great, I still do. Have no idea why you deep thinkers are still thinking about it 5 years later? ?????Get a life and get off the fixation with masks, and getting a shot 5 years ago. Conspiracy brain!

The Wuhan lab workers became sick in November 2019. The vaccine became available to all US citizens in April 2021.

Sorry, it was 17 months later, not 18 months later as I said.

I guess I have to remember that you still think it came from Asians eating bats and pangolins.
 

stoneaxe27

All-American
Sep 22, 2006
5,709
6,679
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The Wuhan lab workers became sick in November 2019. The vaccine became available to all US citizens in April 2021.

Sorry, it was 17 months later, not 18 months later as I said.

I guess I have to remember that you still think it came from Asians eating bats and pangolins.
Don’t twist to make your point. Covid first hit in China in November 2019. Covid vaccine approved and started being given to frontline health people and seniors in early December 2020. Plus it didn’t really cross into US until it hit NY in February and exploded there in March when most places like Florida shutdown to avoid a pandemic. However you look at it about a year, and most people didn’t get covid without vaccines and recover with mild symptoms. The lucky ones did but over a million in US died.
 
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