Why do we continue to schedule non-con baseball as if the opponent doesn't matter?

[Xenomorph]

It's as if we don't understand that every year the margins by which regional host sites (much less, national seeds) are chosen are razor thin. We always say... "The SEC schedule is plenty tough.. it'll take care of RPI". Well.. if we are the program we claim to be then that's BS because plenty of our peers don't schedule like we do.

And yes... the SWAC mid week games are atrocious and need to stop. But I'm really talking about our early season weekend series that we hosted:

Hofstra: RPI 139
Delaware: RPI 240
Lipscomb: RPI 207

WT17 are we doing?

Here's Florida's:

UAB: RPI 35
Kennesaw Sate: RPI 61
High Point: RPI 52

It's not a coincidence that every team above us has played fewer Q4 games. From where I sit it's simple.... Take a teams 4-year average of RPI. If it's +100 then DO NOT BRING THEM IN FOR A WEEKEND SERIES. Do that and you can keep playing Alcorn and watch 87 mph fastballs and Grambling hit every other batter.

I know I'll get some replies that say stuff like.. "Just win in the SEC and everything will take care of itself". Well.. you won't be the first person to be wrong on the internet so post away.

 

[The Cooterpoot]

Because it doesn't matter. The SEC schedule is the RPI driver anyway. LSU lost to Bethune Cookman night. Teams are losing to bad teams on the regular now. We aren't losing to those to this point and that helps us later. We need to win SEC games.

 

[HotMop]

It's as if we don't understand that every year the margins by which regional host sites (much less, national seeds) are chosen are razor thin. We always say... "The SEC schedule is plenty tough.. it'll take care of RPI". Well.. if we are the program we claim to be then that's BS because plenty of our peers don't schedule like we do.

And yes... the SWAC mid week games are atrocious and need to stop. But I'm really talking about our early season weekend series that we hosted:

Hofstra: RPI 139
Delaware: RPI 240
Lipscomb: RPI 207

WT17 are we doing?

Here's Florida's:

UAB: RPI 35
Kennesaw Sate: RPI 61
High Point: RPI 52

It's not a coincidence that every team above us has played fewer Q4 games. From where I sit it's simple.... Take a teams 4-year average of RPI. If it's +100 then DO NOT BRING THEM IN FOR A WEEKEND SERIES. Do that and you can keep playing Alcorn and watch 87 mph fastballs and Grambling hit every other batter.

I know I'll get some replies that say stuff like.. "Just win in the SEC and everything will take care of itself". Well.. you won't be the first person to be wrong on the internet so post away.




View attachment 1248888

Oregon State has the fewest Q4 games and they have a lower SOS than us. Just win in the SEC and everything will take care of itself.

 

[Xenomorph]

Because it doesn't matter. The SEC schedule is the RPI driver anyway. LSU lost to Bethune Cookman night. Teams are losing to bad teams on the regular now. We aren't losing to those to this point and that helps us later

LSU is RPI 75, will not be in the hosting discussion this year and is not currently relevant to this discussion.

 

[Xenomorph]

Oregon State has the fewest Q4 games and they have a lower SOS than us. Just win in the SEC and everything will take care of itself.

OSU has played 2 games against Q4 and is 3 spots ahead of us because we have played 13 against Q4.

They are a perfect example of my point.

Stop scheduling Q4 teams and our profile on selection day changes drastically.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

It's as if we don't understand that every year the margins by which regional host sites (much less, national seeds) are chosen are razor thin. We always say... "The SEC schedule is plenty tough.. it'll take care of RPI". Well.. if we are the program we claim to be then that's BS because plenty of our peers don't schedule like we do.

And yes... the SWAC mid week games are atrocious and need to stop. But I'm really talking about our early season weekend series that we hosted:

Hofstra: RPI 139
Delaware: RPI 240
Lipscomb: RPI 207

WT17 are we doing?

Here's Florida's:

UAB: RPI 35
Kennesaw Sate: RPI 61
High Point: RPI 52

It's not a coincidence that every team above us has played fewer Q4 games. From where I sit it's simple.... Take a teams 4-year average of RPI. If it's +100 then DO NOT BRING THEM IN FOR A WEEKEND SERIES. Do that and you can keep playing Alcorn and watch 87 mph fastballs and Grambling hit every other batter.

I know I'll get some replies that say stuff like.. "Just win in the SEC and everything will take care of itself". Well.. you won't be the first person to be wrong on the internet so post away.




View attachment 1248888

You can't 'schedule' a good team into existence. Either you are or you aren't. Win the games and move on.

I mean you're technically right. But we only care about it when we're an average team.

 

[patdog]

It's as if we don't understand that every year the margins by which regional host sites (much less, national seeds) are chosen are razor thin. We always say... "The SEC schedule is plenty tough.. it'll take care of RPI". Well.. if we are the program we claim to be then that's BS because plenty of our peers don't schedule like we do.

And yes... the SWAC mid week games are atrocious and need to stop. But I'm really talking about our early season weekend series that we hosted:

Hofstra: RPI 139
Delaware: RPI 240
Lipscomb: RPI 207

WT17 are we doing?

Here's Florida's:

UAB: RPI 35
Kennesaw Sate: RPI 61
High Point: RPI 52

It's not a coincidence that every team above us has played fewer Q4 games. From where I sit it's simple.... Take a teams 4-year average of RPI. If it's +100 then DO NOT BRING THEM IN FOR A WEEKEND SERIES. Do that and you can keep playing Alcorn and watch 87 mph fastballs and Grambling hit every other batter.

I know I'll get some replies that say stuff like.. "Just win in the SEC and everything will take care of itself". Well.. you won't be the first person to be wrong on the internet so post away.




View attachment 1248888

Most of those schools have almost as many Q4 games as we do, and to the extent they don't they have a lot more Q3 games (not much better). And the only schools with as many Q1 games are SEC schools. I don't like it either, and I wish we'd drop one of the cripple weekend series and one or two of the SWAC games. But we're projected to have a top 20 strength of schedule by year end.

 

[Shmuley]

It's as if we don't understand that every year the margins by which regional host sites (much less, national seeds) are chosen are razor thin. We always say... "The SEC schedule is plenty tough.. it'll take care of RPI". Well.. if we are the program we claim to be then that's BS because plenty of our peers don't schedule like we do.

And yes... the SWAC mid week games are atrocious and need to stop. But I'm really talking about our early season weekend series that we hosted:

Hofstra: RPI 139
Delaware: RPI 240
Lipscomb: RPI 207

WT17 are we doing?

Here's Florida's:

UAB: RPI 35
Kennesaw Sate: RPI 61
High Point: RPI 52

It's not a coincidence that every team above us has played fewer Q4 games. From where I sit it's simple.... Take a teams 4-year average of RPI. If it's +100 then DO NOT BRING THEM IN FOR A WEEKEND SERIES. Do that and you can keep playing Alcorn and watch 87 mph fastballs and Grambling hit every other batter.

I know I'll get some replies that say stuff like.. "Just win in the SEC and everything will take care of itself". Well.. you won't be the first person to be wrong on the internet so post away.




View attachment 1248888

May I make a potentially irrelevant comment?

May I suggest that we not get our 17ing @$$e$ swept at home as a first step in the process of avoiding doubts about seeding? Just thinking out loud here. Please carry on.

 

[Xenomorph]

May I make a potentially irrelevant comment?

May I suggest that we not get our 17ing @$$e$ swept at home as a first step in the process of avoiding doubts about seeding? Just thinking out loud here. Please carry on.

If you're asking to make the friendly amendment that winning is better than losing.. then..

 

[GloryDawg]

It helps pad batting average and pitching stats.

 

[The Cooterpoot]

LSU is RPI 75, will not be in the hosting discussion this year and is not currently relevant to this discussion.

 

[Maroon13]

My guess is expenses and risk... Is why we schedule like we do.

for example, we could probably schedule South Alabama instead of Lipscomb but South would want more of a buyout and be a bigger risk of a loss.

 

[patdog]

My guess is expenses and risk... Is why we schedule like we do.

for example, we could probably schedule South Alabama instead of Lipscomb but South would want more of a buyout and be a bigger risk of a loss.

We used to play South Alabama every year. We still should. And Tulane regularly.

 

[bulldoghair]

It helps pad batting average and pitching stats.

This.
We drop millions on a baseball program, then turn around and schedule glorified scrimmages so our hitters can chase .400 averages and our pitchers can rack up strikeouts against competition that couldn’t make the cut in most of our community colleges in Mississippi. That’s not development- it’s participation trophy baseball with better facilities.

 

[bulldoghair]

Because it doesn't matter. The SEC schedule is the RPI driver anyway. LSU lost to Bethune Cookman night. Teams are losing to bad teams on the regular now. We aren't losing to those to this point and that helps us later. We need to win SEC games.

You can’t pad your way to a strong RPI. The committee doesn’t care how many times you hung 12 runs on Grambling or at if those other goofy schools. They care about the quality of your wins and the strength of your schedule- I’ve said this before and got criticized. Glad someone else is saying it. All we’re doing is inflating stats against teams that drag our RPI down- and then act surprised when the margins are razor thin in May. Stop treating non con as a victory lap and start treating it like it actually matters. Schedule real competition. Protect the RPI. Act like the program we claim to be. Lord knows we’re wasting enough money to be. Stop playing tee ball in February if we want to be taken seriously in June.

 

[BrunswickDawg]

This is a thread full of ridiculousness.
Our OOC RPI is 13. We have the 4th best OOC RPI in the SEC.
We played the #1 RPI team in the country in our non-con games.
We play OM and USM as non-con teams annually who almost always are Q1 RPIs.
We played Tulane (which Patdog has already forgotten).
We played the #35 RPI school at home less than 24 hours ago.

It sounds more like some people are pissed they can only get tickets for chairbacks to SWAC games so they talk out of their asses about our RPI.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

Another reason to play the gimme games is to get reps for pitchers who are inexperienced or struggling.

There isn't much development going on in college baseball today so take the reps where you can.

 

[MSUDC11-2.0]

I think you’ve gotta weigh our midweeks with noncon scheduling too. There are some SWAC teams in there but we also play Ole Miss on a neutral site every year, have been playing USM twice, have played other decent mid major programs as well. Heck UAB last night is a Top 40 RPI team.

You also can’t disregard us playing three Top 50 teams, including number 1 overall, in a neutral site tourney.

I don’t really understand the frustration with our schedule this year, TBH. We are 12 in the RPI right now. We were 5 until Georgia swept us at home. Our noncon SOS, while not the best, is comparable or better than a number of other Top 15 or 20 teams.

 

[patdog]

We played Tulane (which Patdog has already forgotten).

We should play Tulane REGULARLY.

 

[CoastRat.sixpack]

This is a thread full of ridiculousness.
Our OOC RPI is 13. We have the 4th best OOC RPI in the SEC.
We played the #1 RPI team in the country in our non-con games.
We play OM and USM as non-con teams annually who almost always are Q1 RPIs.
We played Tulane (which Patdog has already forgotten).
We played the #35 RPI school at home less than 24 hours ago.

It sounds more like some people are pissed they can only get tickets for chairbacks to SWAC games so they talk out of their asses about our RPI.

"OM as non-con team"?? Ole Miss? From Oxford, MS? Clearly I'm missing something here.

 

[Xenomorph]

Here are some 4-Year RPI averages:

Our non-con schedule:
Hofstra 156
Delaware 185
Lipscomb 157

At the end of the year it's probably worth 3-4 RPI spots if we replace 2 of them with examples such as:
Iowa 75
Northeastern 65
Xavier 54
Kansas State 60
Troy 54
Woffard 85
Pittsburg 65

Take a look at Auburn. They've played like straight up trash for 3 weeks. 3-8 in their last 11 games. Still, their RPI is currently 5 while ours is 12. Here are their home non-con series:

Youngstown State 278
Nebraska 33
Winthrop 74

As always, it's entirely possible a team like Auburn finishes below us in the SEC yet gets the host nod over us due to schedule and RPI. Will it happen?... maybe, maybe not. But it's year after year we go into selection day with our non-con schedule as a black eye on our profile. It's just such a self-inflicted wound...

 

[BrunswickDawg]

We should play Tulane REGULARLY.

That's probably more on them then it is on us. I honestly didn't realize that we went from 1998 to 2021 without playing them.

 

[BrunswickDawg]

"OM as non-con team"?? Ole Miss? From Oxford, MS? Clearly I'm missing something here.

It's called The Governors Cup. It's played every year.

 

[Xenomorph]

This is a thread full of ridiculousness.
Our OOC RPI is 13. We have the 4th best OOC RPI in the SEC.
We played the #1 RPI team in the country in our non-con games.
We play OM and USM as non-con teams annually who almost always are Q1 RPIs.
We played Tulane (which Patdog has already forgotten).
We played the #35 RPI school at home less than 24 hours ago.

It sounds more like some people are pissed they can only get tickets for chairbacks to SWAC games so they talk out of their asses about our RPI.

It doesn't matter if the house you're trying to sell on Zillow just got a fresh coat of paint when it's being comped against ones that have a new kitchen, new roof and comes with a lifetime warranty on the slab.

What I'm saying is.. if we are trying to consistently be a Top 8 team in the country, we need to start scheduling like it. All that matters at the end of the season is the comps. And currently a schedule comp isn't going to be in our favor.

 

[MagnoliaHunter]

I would think that it is at least partly to let players that are not getting SEC playing time, get some time. Especially young fielders and any pitchers that don't see the field in SEC games. How else are they going to get any better?

 

[She Mate Me]

This.
We drop millions on a baseball program, then turn around and schedule glorified scrimmages so our hitters can chase .400 averages and our pitchers can rack up strikeouts against competition that couldn’t make the cut in most of our community colleges in Mississippi. That’s not development- it’s participation trophy baseball with better facilities.

Have you considered spending more time with the Elite Dawgs. I think you'd love it over there.

 

[Xenomorph]

I would think that it is at least partly to let players that are not getting SEC playing time, get some time. Especially young fielders and any pitchers that don't see the field in SEC games. How else are they going to get any better?

 

[She Mate Me]

I'm on board with trying to schedule better opponents for our early season weekend series. A three game series against a terrible RPI team certainly ain't good for the ole RPI overall.

Who is in charge of putting the non con schedule together and when is it done?

 

[MSUDC11-2.0]

That's probably more on them than it is on us. I honestly didn't realize that we went from 1998 to 2021 without playing them.

I don’t know why we didn’t play them in the 2010’s but my guess for why we didn’t play them in the 2000’s pre-Katrina is they would have kicked our ***.

 

[WrightGuy821]

In that screenshot, we've played more Q1 games than all but Alabama and Florida. That's why we can schedule Q4 teams for early series. Plus playing in a non-con round-robin gives us some leeway too

 

[patdog]

In that screenshot, we've played more Q1 games than all but Alabama and Florida. That's why we can schedule Q4 teams for early series. Plus playing in a non-con round-robin gives us some leeway too

We've got 5 Q1 non-conference games. That's probably as many as most teams have. And yeah, we've got 15 Q4 games, but 6 of them are top 200 games so not completely bottom of the barrel.

 

[She Mate Me]

We've got 5 Q1 non-conference games. That's probably as many as most teams have. And yeah, we've got 15 Q4 games, buweet 6 of them are top 200 games so not completely bottom of the barrel.

You really could mostly fix the issue by having one of the early 3 game series be a team that's likely to be a.Top 100 RPI team. I'm not normally upset with how we schedule, but I don't see a reason to schedule three pretty terrible pre conference weekend series in a year when you've got a good team.

 

[patdog]

You really could mostly fix the issue by having one of the early 3 game series be a team that's likely to be a.Top 100 RPI team. I'm not normally upset with how we schedule, but I don't see a reason to schedule three pretty terrible pre conference weekend series in a year when you've got a good team.

Or at least only play 2 of those teams pre-conference weekends. I think the issue is we've clearly decided we want 3 home weekends prior to conference play. So that pretty much means 3 really bad opponents, although Hofstra is at least a Q3 series. I would like to see us play at least one Q2 or above series in addition to a tournament in Texas every year, even if it does mean giving up a home weekend every other year (which it might not if we can find someone decent from up north to play). Of course its not my revenue that's taking a hit.

 

[theoriginalSALTYdog]

Have you considered spending more time with the Elite Dawgs. I think you'd love it over there.

Well, he's not lying. . . . .

 

[MagnoliaHunter]

practice and actual games even against weaker opponents, especially for younger or backup players, is not the same thing.

 

[MSUDC11-2.0]

You really could mostly fix the issue by having one of the early 3 game series be a team that's likely to be a.Top 100 RPI team. I'm not normally upset with how we schedule, but I don't see a reason to schedule three pretty terrible pre conference weekend series in a year when you've got a good team.

You have to a consider that a lot of the non conference weekends are scheduled a year or two in advance. Not just by us but other teams too.

Don’t get me wrong, I’d have been fine if we had swapped the Delaware or Hofstra series for a series with insert decent-ish mid major team. But I also feel like given our schedule otherwise the difference is still fairly marginal.

 

[patdog]

practice and actual games even against weaker opponents, especially for younger or backup players, is not the same thing.

But how much do our younger players or backups actually play in these games? Not a lot.

 

[ETK99]

You can’t pad your way to a strong RPI. The committee doesn’t care how many times you hung 12 runs on Grambling or at if those other goofy schools. They care about the quality of your wins and the strength of your schedule- I’ve said this before and got criticized. Glad someone else is saying it. All we’re doing is inflating stats against teams that drag our RPI down- and then act surprised when the margins are razor thin in May. Stop treating non con as a victory lap and start treating it like it actually matters. Schedule real competition. Protect the RPI. Act like the program we claim to be. Lord knows we’re wasting enough money to be. Stop playing tee ball in February if we want to be taken seriously in June.

It's all about the SEC schedule. We played UCLA, USM twice, and OM in nonconference. Every SEC team plays terrible teams & most lose to them. This ain't football where there's only 12 games and you really need a big win. Finish near the top of the SEC and you host and are a top 8/16. It's really that easy.

 

[DAWGSANDSAINTS]

May I make a potentially irrelevant comment?

May I suggest that we not get our 17ing @$$e$ swept at home as a first step in the process of avoiding doubts about seeding? Just thinking out loud here. Please carry on.

 

[DAWGSANDSAINTS]

We used to play South Alabama every year. We still should. And Tulane regularly.

Should play UAB, Samford, S Alabama, Austin Peay, Tulane, Memphis and bring down a NE school for a weekend and an upper Midwest school and that’s about it.