He was also a first choice to coach the Detroit Lions and Chicago Bears. Ever hear Franklin whispered about for such jobs? Didn’t think so. And there is a reason for that.
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Not hard to see Campbell is bulking up in the trenches like many have wanted for years...
- Thread starter Bwifan
- Start date
Does he get 10 years to win 1 game? 12?Bite your tongue. Campbell walks on water.....that will never change here.
To be fair, those organizations have not been bastions of success in the last twenty years. They’ve gone through more HCs and QBs than many other teams. Getting those jobs isn’t the same as getting the job at some other organizations. This isn’t a knock on Campbell, but on those organizations.
Page 4. Is the consensus that Campbell is turrible? Just trying to keep up.
Franklin won a Big Ten Championship in year 3 which is the first season when the team had a full compliment of scholarship players and the first season after the worst 2 years of the sanctions. This was also before the transfer portal. He also won 2 playoff games. I have no problem with his firing and hope Campbell kills it at Penn State but I’m not the least bit sorry to ruin your false Franklin Derangement Syndrome narrative with facts. Given that Kraft said Franklin was fired for not living up to Penn State’s “standard” of winning Big and National Championships (despite the fact that the last National Championship was in 1986 when Paterno was coach and the last Big Ten Championship in 2016 under Franklin) and that Penn State fans “deserve” a National Championship and the amount of money Penn State is giving Campbell, there should be absolutely no excuse for not winning at least a Big Ten Championship by 2028 at the latest.
Franklin had the worst big game record of any coach in history and was finally fired accordingly. No syndrome - just the facts.
What about making sure CMC gets at least half as long as Franklin to win two meaningful games? Seems more than fair.
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Bite your tongue. Campbell walks on water.....that will never change here.
8 more years!
He's your hero not mine. I give him credit for knowing how to build powerhouse football programs. Look what he did at Temple and Boston College.
You know this for a fact? Or you heard or read it somewhere? Because God knows, everything in print and social media is fact.
Is making the NFL after being a college coach the measuring stick of coaching greatness? LOL
Nick Saban, Bud Wilkinson, Steve Spurrier, Urban Meyer, Lou Holtz, John Mckay, Chip Kelly.......a few natties in there ....
Campbell will ultimately be judged on his results at PSU. That's all that matters. He must exceed Franklin's record.
"excellence at the highest level," is what we have been promised. This season brings the weakest schedule in memory. MC has imported 24 of his previous squad to PSU. There is no learning curve or transition. They know the system. Let's ride.
Franklin won 13 games and got to a nation championship semi with a "weak schedule." HCMC's got a hand picked imported roster and the weakest schedule (conference) possible. Anything less than 10 wins is failure.
How many other games does a coach need to win to make other games "meaningful?" There are no big games without winning the others.
There are two basic concepts of DL play that all other variations derive from.....1. Have DLineman crash the OL to penetrate and disrupt the offense....2. Have the DLine occupy, maintain and hold their line keeping the OLinemen from reaching the second level and allow the LBers to clean everything up. Both can be successful with proper recruiting. Often this decision stems from available recruits...some demographic areas have different characteristics and body types. Penn State didn’t become LBU by chance or mistake.
You must be totally obtuse. Franklin won a Big Ten Championship in his third season. He also won two playoff games. For the mathematically challenged that’s 3 meaningful wins. Why exactly should Campbell get at least 6 years since Krafty fired Franklin for not meeting the “standard” of winning Big and National Championships when Franklin won a Big in year 3 and Campbell has all this NIL money to spend. Since I can walk and chew gum at the same time, I can truly hope Campbell achieves all that success Kraft promised and take a wait and see approach to how he does in a tougher league.
I guess all the schools outside of a couple didn’t get the memo about it being a physical conference since James went 63-22 against all of them.
And what did our calling card get us after we joined the Big Ten? That wouldn’t be okay these days.
HCMC had to put a team together last minute due to the fumbling of our coaching search. We’re in a massive rebuild. “Hand-picked” is a highly inaccurate characterization of what happened. Our roster made up of transfers and retentions, even with an ISU discount for the transfers, was enormously expensive to put together and will take a couple years to get closer to normal. I hope we win 10 games and there’s certainly potential to do some good things, but if we believe that’s the floor after 6-6 disaster, that’s just not realistic.
I couldn't disagree more. Why would bringing ISU players to PSU be "enormously expensive?" All I've heard is how HCMC did wonders with no resources. It shouldn't have taken a king's ransom to lure his team to a team whose AD claims has massive resources.
You bring in YOUR 5th year starting QB along with a few linemen, RB and multiple WR and TE. To be coached in the offense they ran at ISU with the same OC. I have read right here, that PSU retained the only players that mattered.....so that's another plus. 7-6 was a disaster, but I find it precious that no one mentions the 10,11, and 13 win seasons that preceded it. Franklin and Kraft locked horns and Franklin didn't produce last season. He's gone. He was going if the results were the opposite. That marriage was over. So now, we have a new regime. Kraft promised "excellence at the highest level." You can all make excuses.
In the current state of college football, you pay to retain or import your roster. Every single year. Kraft opted to wash away the recruiting class, as he had no regard for them. PSU will be diving into the portal aggressively and with volume for some time to come. I read where we should be beating OSU, UM and Oregon. Do their fans accept a rebuild? PSU has 3 games that should be competitive. Or as our loyal fans identified as "having a pulse." Asking them to win one isn't okay? I mean we hired a guy to win big games, right? You retort by saying Franklin lost to Northwestern and UCLA. Yes, and he was fired mid season.
Fanboys love to use Cignetti. Cignetti only brought 13 players from James Madison. What was Indiana's record the year before he came? Franklin established a pretty good track record of winning the games he was favored to win. That's all I'm expecting for Coach Campbell this year. Penn State at the moment is expected to be favored in 10 games.
Go Cylions beat Buffalo!
Yup....63 wins against Rutgers, Maryland, and the worst teams in B1G...how often did he win against top comptition? I presume you base your life against the weakest possible terms.
Marv Levy lost 4 consecutive big games (super bowls) and Bud Grant lost all 4 as well. Both are in the HOF. Winning every week, even when fans perceive the opponent doesn't "have a pulse" is very challenging. I've been hearing rumors for some time that colleges other than PSU are giving scholarships and NIL to players and hiring expert coaches and strength and conditioning staffs and didn't get the memo that they exist to be pushed around by blueblood PSU.
PSU was the home of the greatest educator coach of all time. But if you poll the experts here, he is Joe but. As in, I loved Joe, but........LOL. Some are broke and will never be fixed. It's unrealistic for most here to acknowledge that Franklin ran a pretty damn good program and the relationship just burnt out......and still be hopeful that Campbell can take the 10 win seasons to 11 and the 11 win seasons to 12 etc. Kraft didn't use the word rebuild when he set the standard after he fired Franklin. He was very clear that the next guy would bring a NC. Not words I would have used. Promising "excellence at the highest level" was his choice, not mine. But perhaps he felt compelled to do so because the guy he fired was pretty successful?
I'm confused. Are we critical of Franklin for beating the teams he should have beaten? Because I'm pretty sure that even the teams that win "big games" pad their records against the second division teams.
So he gets no credit for beating the Northwesterns, but gets fired for losing to them? Sounds logical to me.
Franklin coached 149 games at PSU 104-45 overall and 64-36 Big Ten Conference. I wonder what PSU's record was for the prior 150 games? You know I know. But suffice it to say he did better than the outcome of the previous 13 seasons. So, while one can hope.....it's hard to argue that "we deserve better," unless we go back 40 years.
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Definitely a poor choice of words by Kraft. My take, O'Brien and the players who stayed after Joe's unjust firing, saved the football program. When O'Brien abruptly left PSU, Franklin came in picked up the broken pieces, solidified the program even more, and in so many ways did an excellent job of returning PSU to a top 10-15 program. I think his undoing was going to the well too often for more personal pay after being given everything he asked for program wise and an incredible coaching salary/benefits. When he allegedly went behind Krafts back to the President and possibly BOT, it caused a chasm between him and the administration that became impassable. He then seemed to give less than maximum effort which resulted in the rapid downward spiral of the program. The separation had to occur. Thank you for your service. Time to move on and support CMC, new staff, and players. Kraft's days may also be numbered.
Well said.
I really liked James Franklin when he was hired, and I think he did an excellent job bringing Penn State football back to prominence.
Too many fans forget that in his first year, Franklin out-coached Meyer but lost mainly because of the O'Neill screw job: a ball rolling on the ground ruled an interception deep in Penn State territory, leading to a Buckeye TD; a FG counted although it was kicked 4 seconds after the play clock hit 0:00. Those 10 points basically gave the game to OSU, who needed double OT to win it.
Thus, early James Franklin was a fantastic HC. But then something happened to him in the last 4-5 years. He became very insecure, arguing with fans, creating a less-than-welcome environment for lettermen from before 2014.
Perhaps his ego grew too large to cope with a fan base like Penn State's and with beat writers who seemed to relish negativity for fear of looking like "homers."
Perhaps he dwelled too much on social media criticisms or on ESPN's nearly constant mantra of how many times he lost to Ohio State. But the James Franklin of 2020-2025 was not the same guy as from 2014-2019.
Now it's Matt Campbell's turn to deal with the fan base, ESPN, and negative beat writers (although Jones is now gone). I think Campbell is an outstanding HC for Penn State. He's welcoming the past while building for the future. As a fan for 60+ years, I honestly am fine with the old-time "play for a NC every 4 or 5 years" concept. Sure, it seems like paradise to have the annual success of Ohio State or Alabama, but I am not quite sure I want Penn State to emulate the paths those 2 programs took to get there.
I guess I'm content to be what Matt said in his pc: "slow and right."
75+ portabled out and graduated. It is the largest rebuild in cfb history. In this new world it is very expensive to retain during a coaching change (Rojas was a mill himself) and even more so to portal in starters, even ISU starters. Becht was being pursued very hard by LSU, for example. This is not a normal cycle, and in fact will take a couple years to renormalize roster construction. We are coming off a 6-6 reg season, which includes giving up 533 yards vs Rutgers and winning on a lucky fumble.
Who is my hero? CMC? He will have to earn just being a good PSU football coach first..
CMC scrambled for scraps. Let’s see what he can do. He has an easy schedule but has a lot of ISU players. Most will give him a few years. His contract is 8!
Check the record - that is your answer. No one is impressed by getting pushed around by Villanova. And it finally caught up with him. Time for someone else to get a bite at the Apple.
VA Tech will take your NIL contribution and season tix donations. Enjoy.
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Obtuse. Checking your thesaurus? I am quite sure that CMC will be able to beat mighty SMU and Potato State after he gets a decade or so under his belt.
Go make that silly argument to someone who knows College Football. You will be laughed out of the room. You could have combined the rosters of both of those Little Sisters of the poor and Penn State should have beaten them.
Lots of wins…and many in big games…Michigan and Ohio State on the road. Major bowl wins. NYT National Championship. Greatest offensive football team in history. So that.
Fanboys like Franklin. VA Tech has seating options for you. Have at it!
Franklin had his chance for over a decade. He did OK. We will try to do better. 8 more years!
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Franklin is gone. Time to get signed up for the ACC football TV package. He had his chance. He did well. But he failed in almost every single big game. The record is the record.I'm confused. Are we critical of Franklin for beating the teams he should have beaten? Because I'm pretty sure that even the teams that win "big games" pad their records against the second division teams.
So he gets no credit for beating the Northwesterns, but gets fired for losing to them? Sounds logical to me.
Franklin coached 149 games at PSU 104-45 overall and 64-36 Big Ten Conference. I wonder what PSU's record was for the prior 150 games? You know I know. But suffice it to say he did better than the outcome of the previous 13 seasons. So, while one can hope.....it's hard to argue that "we deserve better," unless we go back 40 years.
For the 100th time, Penn State has witnessed more big wins in one month of Paterno than 12 years of Franklin.
Only fanboys of Franklin would accept his record in big games as worthy of a blueblood.
And that maroon and orange gear can look snappy on those who are interested in seeing that level of performance continue.