MBB options for next season

[18IsTheMan]

1. Fire Paris, pay the buyout, move forward with a new coach

2. Retain Paris, increase NIL spending

3. Retain Paris, maintain current NIL spending, fire him when the buyout is cheaper

From a fiscal perspective, #3 makes the most sense. Basketball isn't a major revenue generator in the first place, so even if we retain Paris and the team sucks next year, it doesn't hit our bottom line that hard with lost revenue.

#s 1 and 2 are debatable. Do we care enough about basketball to make the steep financial investment either one requires? Paris has certainly been bad enough, in the conversation for our worst coaches ever, to warrant being fired. But can we justify a $12+ million buyout for basketball? #1 makes exceedingly more sense to me than #2 though. Retaining Paris and increasing his NIL spending with what he has shown in coaching so far would be like buying a brand new Mercedes for a teenager who has wrecked the family station wagon 3 times.

There are no great options, but 3 is probably the most sensible. Just tread water on this thing for another season, hope football blows up next season and then make a move. On the financial side, the thinking is we can't afford to pay his buyout, but it would cost nearly as much if we made a serious NIL commitment to rebuild the roster for him. All this for a coach who has, thus far, not demonstrated any coaching ability.

 

[3USC1801]

@18IsTheMan wrote:
“On the financial side, the thinking is we can't afford to pay his buyout, but it would cost nearly as much if we made a serious NIL commitment to rebuild the roster for him. All this for a coach who has, thus far, not demonstrated any coaching ability.”

If USC made the commitment to increase NIL for Paris, I would assume they would do it for a new coach, too. So, the expenditure would be the same regardless if they kept him or hired a new coach. If that is true, then keeping Paris would still be cheaper than firing him (cost $12 million for buyout is my understanding) AND then hiring a new coach ($4 million? per annum). It comes down to donor money and how much the university has to spend.

 

[18IsTheMan]

@18IsTheMan wrote:
“On the financial side, the thinking is we can't afford to pay his buyout, but it would cost nearly as much if we made a serious NIL commitment to rebuild the roster for him. All this for a coach who has, thus far, not demonstrated any coaching ability.”

If USC made the commitment to increase NIL for Paris, I would assume they would do it for a new coach, too. So, the expenditure would be the same regardless if they kept him or hired a new coach. If that is true, then keeping Paris would still be cheaper than firing him (cost $12 million for buyout is my understanding) AND then hiring a new coach ($4 million? per annum). It comes down to donor money and how much the university has to spend.

It's true, which is why I said #3 probably makes the most fiscal sense. Do you think Paris has shown enough coaching chops to say all he needs is more NIL money? To me, it would be epitome of throwing good money after bad to increase NIL under Paris.

The man simply is not a good coach.

 

[3USC1801]

It's true, which is why I said #3 probably makes the most fiscal sense. Do you think Paris has shown enough coaching chops to say all he needs is more NIL money? To me, it would be epitome of throwing good money after bad to increase NIL under Paris.

The man simply is not a good coach.

I agree with you that he’s had enough time to show his caliber of coaching, and it lacks. However, I’d like to be wrong and see him succeed. I just don’t see it happening.

 

[18IsTheMan]

I agree with you that he’s had enough time to show his caliber of coaching, and it lacks. However, I’d like to be wrong and see him succeed. I just don’t see it happening.

If we retain Paris and increase our NIL commitment, we deserve what we get.

 

[Dabo's Weenie]

I vote we keep him, extend his contract and increase the buyout.

To do otherwise might result in unintended consequences - this place gets too dead when there isn't enough to complain about.

 

[Legal_fowl]

1. Fire Paris, pay the buyout, move forward with a new coach

2. Retain Paris, increase NIL spending

3. Retain Paris, maintain current NIL spending, fire him when the buyout is cheaper

From a fiscal perspective, #3 makes the most sense. Basketball isn't a major revenue generator in the first place, so even if we retain Paris and the team sucks next year, it doesn't hit our bottom line that hard with lost revenue.

#s 1 and 2 are debatable. Do we care enough about basketball to make the steep financial investment either one requires? Paris has certainly been bad enough, in the conversation for our worst coaches ever, to warrant being fired. But can we justify a $12+ million buyout for basketball? #1 makes exceedingly more sense to me than #2 though. Retaining Paris and increasing his NIL spending with what he has shown in coaching so far would be like buying a brand new Mercedes for a teenager who has wrecked the family station wagon 3 times.

There are no great options, but 3 is probably the most sensible. Just tread water on this thing for another season, hope football blows up next season and then make a move. On the financial side, the thinking is we can't afford to pay his buyout, but it would cost nearly as much if we made a serious NIL commitment to rebuild the roster for him. All this for a coach who has, thus far, not demonstrated any coaching ability.

No reputable coach will take this job without top NIL dollars. If we fire Lamont his replacement will face the same challenges without more NIL. Change for the sake of change is stupid. Give Lamont 10 million in NIL and see what happens.

 

[Cybercock]

No reputable coach will take this job without top NIL dollars. If we fire Lamont his replacement will face the same challenges without more NIL. Change for the sake of change is stupid. Give Lamont 10 million in NIL and see what happens.

10 million dollars for 11 players. What stupid priorities society has. This is why fans are leaving.

 

[RL09]

If we retain Paris and increase our NIL commitment, we deserve what we get.

I think we would be foolish to retain Paris and waste even more NIL money with him.

 

[RL09]

No reputable coach will take this job without top NIL dollars. If we fire Lamont his replacement will face the same challenges without more NIL. Change for the sake of change is stupid. Give Lamont 10 million in NIL and see what happens.

Lamont Paris is not a good coach for this level, we would be foolish to retain him. There are better coaches we coach hire and with the nil he would be able to build a better program quickly

 

[Sweetwatergolf]

10 million dollars for 11 players. What stupid priorities society has. This is why fans are leaving.

Winning will bring back fans to games. Remember when WBB was almost empty, then DS comes along with wins.......

 

[Legal_fowl]

10 million dollars for 11 players. What stupid priorities society has. This is why fans are leaving.

I agree. There is no such thing as amateur sports any more.

 

[Cybercock]

Winning will bring back fans to games. Remember when WBB was almost empty, then DS comes along with wins.......

True but who are the fools that believe winning is worth wasting hard earned money to make millionaires out of kids that couldn't care less about them or the school.
They laugh all the way to the bank.

 

[Dabo's Weenie]

No reputable coach will take this job without top NIL dollars. If we fire Lamont his replacement will face the same challenges without more NIL. Change for the sake of change is stupid. Give Lamont 10 million in NIL and see what happens.

He goes oh-fer the entire season or just in SEC play?

 

[atl-cock]

I agree. There is no such thing as amateur sports any more.

What about NCAA D-II, D-III, and the NAIA?

 

[Forkcock]

Why new threads about firing Paris every day?

 

[18IsTheMan]

Why new threads about firing Paris every day?

Well, because he's in discussion for worst basketball coach we've ever had.

 

[1vagamecock]

No reputable coach will take this job without top NIL dollars. If we fire Lamont his replacement will face the same challenges without more NIL. Change for the sake of change is stupid. Give Lamont 10 million in NIL and see what happens.

Of that fails, as it almost certainly must, our new AD might cement his name as one of our worst.

 

[Legal_fowl]

Lamont Paris is not a good coach for this level, we would be foolish to retain him. There are better coaches we coach hire and with the nil he would be able to build a better program quickly

Why do you say that? The W/L record, recruiting or how the team plays?

With LP or a new coach, the NIL needs to be close to 10 million if we can do it.

 

[Sweetwatergolf]

Why do you say that? The W/L record, recruiting or how the team plays?

With LP or a new coach, the NIL needs to be close to 10 million if we can do it.

I hate the NIL, Portal rules more than anything. However, this is how you play now or get left behind.

 

[PrestonyteParrot]

We could let Dawn coach both women's and men's.
Couldn't be any worse and it would put butts in the seats and TV cameras in the arena consistently.

 

[18IsTheMan]

We could let Dawn coach both women's and men's.
Couldn't be any worse and it would put butts in the seats and TV cameras in the arena consistently.

As opposed as I generally am to such things, I might actually be intrigued by Dawn as the men's coach. She can obviously teach the game exceptionally well.

That said, I'm guessing there's a reason a women's coach has never crossed over to be a men's head coach (Maybe there has).

 

[atl-cock]

Well, because he's in discussion for worst basketball coach we've ever had.

I don't think he's the worst, but he's down there for sure.

 

[18IsTheMan]

I don't think he's the worst, but he's down there for sure.

Yeah, probably not, but there won't be a great deal of distinction if he loses out. His overall conference record will be just a tiny smidge better than Newtons.

 

[StickyBandit]

No reputable coach will take this job without top NIL dollars. If we fire Lamont his replacement will face the same challenges without more NIL. Change for the sake of change is stupid. Give Lamont 10 million in NIL and see what happens.

He was given $8M for this season and only spent about $5M. And if he needed more, he could have gotten more. You are hitching your wagon to a guy that is out of his league. He has to go.

 

[StickyBandit]

Why do you say that? The W/L record, recruiting or how the team plays?

With LP or a new coach, the NIL needs to be close to 10 million if we can do it.

Why? Paris is sitting at a 60-64 record currently. 3 of his 4 seasons here have been some of the worst seasons in our history as a program. He has 18 20+ point losses in less than 4 seasons. By comparison, it took Frank almost 9 full seasons to have that many 20+ point losses. His recruiting has been mostly extreme misses with some incredibly highly questionable (and sometimes just downright awful) additions to the roster. He can’t seem to make up his mind why the identity of his team will be . We heard they will be good defenders, they will rebound when he started here. Last season he randomly put together a frank Martin type roster with pure athleticism but didn’t change the scheme defensively to play fast in transition. Now we put together a TEMU version of 2024-25. The mean literally can’t attract top talent here because they want to play for a winner. He’s completely checked out on NIL. There is no reason to stick with him at this point.

 

[Sweetwatergolf]

He was given $8M for this season and only spent about $5M. And if he needed more, he could have gotten more. You are hitching your wagon to a guy that is out of his league. He has to go.

Any proof on the 8m and 5m, getting more. I find that hard to believe with any coach doing that with the way CBB is run today.

 

[18IsTheMan]

Any proof on the 8m and 5m, getting more. I find that hard to believe with any coach doing that with the way CBB is run today.

There is never any proof on NIL.

 

[Sweetwatergolf]

There is never any proof on NIL.

My point exactly with people making statements I referred to.

 

[18IsTheMan]

My point exactly with people making statements I referred to.

Yep. Our NIL budget could be $5,000 or $15 million for all that anyone here knows.

 

[Piscis]

Winning will bring back fans to games. Remember when WBB was almost empty, then DS comes along with wins.......

WBB still loses money. It will take a full season of winning pretty big to change the trajectory of the MBB program and attendance numbers. Even then, MBB will not be a big money maker. MBB likely already turns a profit thanks to the tv and SEC money but football still drives the bus in athletics.

 

[atl-cock]

Yeah, probably not, but there won't be a great deal of distinction if he loses out. His overall conference record will be just a tiny smidge better than Newtons.

I think of Walt Hambrick, who coached the 1958-1959 Gamecocks to a 4-20 record, 2-12 in the ACC, good for 8th place in the league. That to me is ultimate rock bottom.

 

[atl-cock]

WBB still loses money. It will take a full season of winning pretty big to change the trajectory of the MBB program and attendance numbers. Even then, MBB will not be a big money maker. MBB likely already turns a profit thanks to the tv and SEC money but football still drives the bus in athletics.

Football revenue allows other sports to enjoy excellent facilities instead of just "clean and standard" ones.

 

[18IsTheMan]

I think of Walt Hambrick, who coached the 1958-1959 Gamecocks to a 4-20 record, 2-12 in the ACC, good for 8th place in the league. That to me is ultimate rock bottom.

Yeah. I don't really scroll back in our history much past the 60s since it's get too hard to draw meaningful comparisons. But, yeah, that's pretty awful.

Side note, going back to the 20's....how awesome of a name for a coach was Branch Bocock?

 

[18IsTheMan]

Football revenue allows other sports to enjoy excellent facilities instead of just "clean and standard" ones.

Every other program feasts on the largesse of the football program.

 

[atl-cock]

Every other program feasts on the largesse of the football program.

From what I've gleaned, we would still sponsor a goodly number of sports even without football. Football enables feasting on steak instead of PBJs. I imagine a good example would be teams getting new uniforms each season. Even something as subtle as surnames on the back of the jerseys.

 

[StickyBandit]

Any proof on the 8m and 5m, getting more. I find that hard to believe with any coach doing that with the way CBB is run

My point exactly with people making statements I referred to.

Yeah, I mean no one has the financial documents in front of them, but this info was from an employee of a pay site so I’d say that the likelihood of it being true is far more likely than hearing it on twitter since they are dealing with actual sources and not just their best friends, cousins brother. But you can do with the info what you like.

 

[StickyBandit]

Yep. Our NIL budget could be $5,000 or $15 million for all that anyone here knows.

Well, I’ve seen a few people talk about the budget for basketball being $8M which more than doubled from last season. Pay sites reporting the entire budget was no used. My understanding is that Chris Clark had comments discussing the NIL budget too if you want to read more from this site. So I’d say there are plenty of people saying very similar things.

 

[KingWard]

If we retain Paris and increase our NIL commitment, we deserve what we get.

And I think that, in a perverse sort of way, you would be correct whichever way it goes.

 

[KingWard]

I vote we keep him, extend his contract and increase the buyout.

To do otherwise might result in unintended consequences - this place gets too dead when there isn't enough to complain about.

We've rarely suffered from a shortage.