The pessimism here is way overdone
- Thread starter fluoxetine
- Start date
But apparently we’ll win 8 or 9 in the big ten because Pike can coach D and our offense can’t be “that” bad (no analytical reasons ever give ln). Right.
Theee is. Lot of reason to be butter after last season …but it’s time to flush it and move in
With 12 scholarships and no seniors …we will be really green . Even with 7 cuocakes on the roster, going to be hard to predict more than 7 wins out of confrwnce . I can see is gettong 14-17 again
But here is the REAL question . Pike, I think, will get these guys to play hard and compete …not a given but I think it will happen With minutes, sone of these guys will develop
So …can this team look better in February then November to carry to the next year to have hope for a rise in 2026-2027
If we can keep 7 of our top 9 for the year after and upgrade again next offseason bwtween the class of 2026 and tbe portal …we can get this thing on traxk
The elephant is NIL funds to retain and add ….got to raise it .
With 12 scholarships and no seniors …we will be really green . Even with 7 cuocakes on the roster, going to be hard to predict more than 7 wins out of confrwnce . I can see is gettong 14-17 again
But here is the REAL question . Pike, I think, will get these guys to play hard and compete …not a given but I think it will happen With minutes, sone of these guys will develop
So …can this team look better in February then November to carry to the next year to have hope for a rise in 2026-2027
If we can keep 7 of our top 9 for the year after and upgrade again next offseason bwtween the class of 2026 and tbe portal …we can get this thing on traxk
The elephant is NIL funds to retain and add ….got to raise it .
Jeez, you're obsessed with him. Just block him or stop responding to him.
We had a lot of close games go against us last season in the beginning. This team will really need to gel quickly to reach .500. If they couldn't do it with 2 5 stars leading the way, what are the chances it will happen next season? This will need to be PIkes greatest coaching moment to be successful. And what will that success look like? NIT? As fans we can't be happy with that.
????, Not sure who this segment is that you speak of ? Most here realize the financial situation and what we are up against. There has als literally been multiple threads and hundreds of posts on this board about how RU is behind in both NIL for Roster Build as well as Funding. There have also been numerous posters who have been chastised for urging others to donate to NIL. If I'm correct - you have been one to the high volume posters leading the Anti-NIL charge and anti-funding of RU for NIL/Roster development - but at the same time are now appear to be complaining about RU fans having their heads in the sand about being on the low $$$ scale compared to conference mates.
https://rutgers.forums.rivals.com/threads/financial-realities-some-programs-have-huge.291387/
My main concern is that we seemingly still need to acquire our best and most expensive player - while having our lowest available funds of the off season.
We've spent all the other money (freshman, retention, Fall/Francis/Buchanan/Zrno).
That will limit available players.
Obviously it's a trade off.
But I think I would have dealt with a lower caliber of player than Fall, Francis, Buchanan in exchange for a higher caliber scoring guard/wing.
Pay a little less for players 7-13 on the roster to have more money to get a better #1.
I'd rather have a $1 bill and couple more nickles than our collection of dimes and add a quarter.
We've spent all the other money (freshman, retention, Fall/Francis/Buchanan/Zrno).
That will limit available players.
Obviously it's a trade off.
But I think I would have dealt with a lower caliber of player than Fall, Francis, Buchanan in exchange for a higher caliber scoring guard/wing.
Pay a little less for players 7-13 on the roster to have more money to get a better #1.
I'd rather have a $1 bill and couple more nickles than our collection of dimes and add a quarter.
So this is why people get a bit frustrated with you.
(1) The Torvik projection, incomplete as it is, is probably the most purely analytical thing actually available this early and puts us much closer to "the same as last year" than it does Hill/Jordan levels. You are aware of the existance of this now.
(2) While analytical analysis 6 months before the season of a team than retains only 3 players from the previous year is obviously scant, you are also not giving analytical reasons. You think YOUR view is the one that gets to be the default and it is only people with a different view that need to provide evidence. That's ********.
(3) Things like "Pike's defenses are usually good so I think the defense has a good chance of being good" IS a logical thing to think. If anything, if you think the defense will NOT be good, the burden should be on you to explain why given that most of Pike's defenses have been good. "Last year's was bad" is not a good reason because almost all those players are gone.
Similarly, "we won't be 300th" is a perfectly reasonable baseline view of offense. If you think we WILL be 300th, YOU SHOULD EXPLAIN WHY. You just treat it as the default even though that was, by far, Pike's worst offense at Rutgers and way worse than the vast majority of his Stony Brook teams too. No one is expecting 80 points a game or even to have an offense that is not considered "bad" for a power conference team but actually being one of the worst offenses IN DIVISION ONE required a perfect storm of bad offense.
The pessimism IMHO is well earned by Pike, his staff and the whole athletic department.
I was wildly optimistic, as were many fellow fans, based on the hype by many in the program. no more.
To quote thr Who, we “Won’t get fooled again”
I was wildly optimistic, as were many fellow fans, based on the hype by many in the program. no more.
To quote thr Who, we “Won’t get fooled again”
I'm not arguing for hype though, I'm arguing that we will go 7-13 instead of 2-18.
Wow! Breathe. I never mentioned you specifically but oh my goodness are you hyper defensive. While I did borrow your descriptiveness of not being “that” bad, you did use Torvik and I did give you credit for it. I was talking about the folks who assume “Buchanan will return to his frosh form”, “Francis’ game from NJIT will translate”, Fall will throw down dunks like Cliff did (getting assisted by Mulchay)”, the European kid will knock down spot up shots (when Pikes offense hasn’t allowed that for any spit up shooter we’ve brought in before)”. Yes, those I feel need detail. I see where you think I bunched you in with others and for that I apologize. But I did feel if you felt confident in your defense of your position then yoh wouldn’t think I was singling you out. Also I didn’t respond to a direct post of yours I was responding to BAC. Again, I’m sorry.
who said those "..." you put up? who is beating that drum? who do you feel you need to hear from specifically and also educate time and time (and time) again that will absolutely suck next year?
surely you can give a list of posters who have totally bought in?
I don’t keep a list of posters I have to fire back at. I also don’t keep exact score of who’s for or against an opinion. I don’t have that kind of time. But those opinions have been voiced. Maybe once maybe twenty times. It’s just like when last year no one ever claimed the team was “final four bound”, but people said it. I think it was even someone’s handle.
alright well you make sure you keep letting these random guys who may have said something one time know what time it is...i'm not sure they're convinced.
How could it put us anywhere given completely different teams
Its completely worthless now
If you want to use it do note that 9 big 10 schools are in top 30
What place is rutgers..oh
?? What are you talking about?
(1) We don't need that many things to go well in order to have a normal bad offense (e.g. #110).
(2) Again you assume your view as the default and claim that others should justify why they are different.
Back to ?? what are you talking about?
I created this thread it's all a response to my post in some way but I didn't and do not take personal affront to your posting. I just don't agree with it.
There are stats or recruiting rankings for most of the players.
It's pretty much guesswork but it's not completely worthless.
If you want to make an argument that we go 4-16 because it's a historically strong year for the conference, then do it. But that is not the argument anyone has made so far.
In terms of conference record, sure. Not sure why you are fixated on Nebraska.
Worst case for this upcoming year could be pretty bad. We could be basically done, and any last portal addition could make Francis look like Braeden Smith. Zrno could not translate to the step up in comp. Fall could be what he's shown and there's a reason people haven't put him on the court. Buchannon's frosh year, could be his high point. Grant could continue to be a 23% shooter from three. It could be pretty bad.
It also could be at least OK. Maybe our last addition is the teams best player. Maybe Zrno turns out to play like an upperclassmen off the bat. Maybe Francis does add something offensively no one else on the team has. Maybe Fall and EO give a solid defensive presence for 40 minutes a night and chip in 8-10 points a game. Maybe Buchannon is as good as I think he can be. Grant, Dortch, Davis all improve with age.
I think the unknown is just as interesting to me. Seeing how these scenario's play out is something to look forward to.
Pike has to have the team look like there is a future for him this year. A return to a team that competes for 40 minutes is his best hope. That kind of team is fun to watch, even though the offense can be painful at times.
It also could be at least OK. Maybe our last addition is the teams best player. Maybe Zrno turns out to play like an upperclassmen off the bat. Maybe Francis does add something offensively no one else on the team has. Maybe Fall and EO give a solid defensive presence for 40 minutes a night and chip in 8-10 points a game. Maybe Buchannon is as good as I think he can be. Grant, Dortch, Davis all improve with age.
I think the unknown is just as interesting to me. Seeing how these scenario's play out is something to look forward to.
Pike has to have the team look like there is a future for him this year. A return to a team that competes for 40 minutes is his best hope. That kind of team is fun to watch, even though the offense can be painful at times.
Fair enough. Im just saying after the past 2 years I have a low opinion for the way thing have progressed. I will still support the team and I hope they have a good season but my expectations for the next year or so are pretty low.
Why are you obsessed with him and I.Take your own advise and do the blocking thing.
I wish I could be more optimistic, but for things to even go ok, too many things have to go better than can reasonably expected.
-I generally don’t have a problem with the Buchanan pick up, but most of his scoring happens around the rim, which will be so much more difficult for him in the BIG.
-I think Zrno is an interesting pick up, but he is taking a major step up in competition, and he is used to getting open shots in a motion European offense, vs trying to get off shots under Pike’s iso offense. It will be a major challenge for him.
-Francis was the best player on a very bad low major team, and no other Power conference team would even consider adding him to their roster, never mind playing a significant role.
-We have no idea if we will get anything out of Fall, and Ogbole, who will be 25 next year, sucks.
-It is not hard to make a case that no one on our roster would be a starter on any of the Top 10 BIG teams.
-In recent years, Pike’s teams have not gotten off to a good start, and have taken a long time to figure out roles and rotations. Also, notwithstanding the roster and talent challenges he has faced, it seems like other teams, particularly good teams, have figured out how to defeat Pike’s defense by waiting for Rutgers to overplay players with the ball, and as long as they move the ball quickly there are plenty of open 3s and easy cuts to the rim.
Pike may not get fired after next year because of his contract, but it is looking pretty bad for him.
Great post. I agree. There is a very broad range of outcomes. The unfortunate difference is that the floor is considerably lower than it has been for a long time at Rutgers.
Sadly, I don’t think the range of outcomes is that broad, I think it is mainly how bad it will be.
I don’t know - I think 5th ranked Pike’s D would’ve worked out fine two years ago if we weren’t historically bad at offense. 298 isn’t just bad, it’s disgusting for a major conference team. It’s certainly not impossible that this happens again but for what it’s worth, even if not one player on our team would start on another BIG roster, odds still heavily favor the likelihood of us having a better offense than that.
I mean, it is. We could be like Eddie Jordan bad. Or we could win 16-18 games if everything goes right. That’s pretty broad.
A couple of things. The roster next year is terrible. And then this is my personal opinion, but I think Pike’s defense is gimmicky and good teams have figured out it is not hard to defeat with ball movement. As college becomes more like the pros, with more focus on getting more good 3 point looks, Pike is a dinosaur, who can’t stop teams that shoot lots of threes.
Think most believe that as most likely, but hey, now is the time for optimism!
Yes - that would be the Vegas line on it IMO. Not an NCAA contender. Also not Eddie Jordan level terrible. Mostly likely outcome - not quite good enough to be a fringe bubble team. That’s how I see it.
But understand that the difference between this outcome and a 17 or 18 win fringe bubble team is paper thin and could be the difference of a couple lucky bounces.
This will be more similar to Pike’s first 2 seasons.
They didn’t address the center position adequately. Fall, like Ogbole, is another 3rd center option. Francis is a bad signing. Buchanan is okay and Zrno is an unknown.
The last spot isn’t going to be anyone that knocks our socks off either. It’s really not even close to a couple of lucky bounces. This roster is not good at all.
There is no reality for this post when you are talking about few lucky bounces from fringe bubble team
The likely Vegas line sits at 13-18
The press D Pike used in the last 2 games this year was great. If stamina wasn’t a thing and it was possible to have played that style all the time without Dylan and Ace (but especially Dylan) getting winded we would’ve been much better in my opinion.
That would be a good year for this roster. Hoping to stay away from a Miami/Seton Hall type year.
13-18 seems kind. This is last year seton hall bad. 10 wins seems right. Parallel to football would be Chris Ash bad,
i am trying to be kind to the poster who suggested we could be a few bounces away from a fringe bubble team...I think worst case is 9 wins, best case 15
And you know this how? If you're so certain take a vegas trip and bet your retirement money on it. Be strong.
Last edited:
With all due respect, this is why threads get out of hand. Though a mild version of how threads get out of hand.
I disagree with Bac - or really want to.
But he did not say he KNOWS ... he specifically said "I think". So not "know" but "think ... i.e. opinion.
Latest
-
01
The Knight Report
How to watch Rutgers / Howard; Pregame Info, Spread, More: Gameday Central
-
02
The Knight Report
Join The Knight Report TODAY and get it for 60% off!
-
03
The Knight Report
Field Suites are coming to Rutgers Football, SHI Stadium
-
04
The Knight Report
Rutgers' Jersey Patch Deal Is Close; Here's the Latest
-
05
The Knight Report
Inside Rutgers' Scarlet Knight Enterprises | CEO Fred Mangione - TKR Pod