Tales from the Ash

[RUInsanityToo]

Like I said, pretty much everybody knows that hiring a first time head coach to lead an RU program in the Big Ten has a low probability of success. But they also know that there's no value, at the start of a new coach's term, of belaboring that negative point. The only substantive impact will be to irritate people.

If one defines success as winning a Big Ten championship, hiring GSII has a low probability of success. Look at the Big Ten's history. Most teams in the bottom half of the Big Ten have a low probability of that sort of success, right? And RU is most definitely in the lower half of the Big Ten at the moment.

However, rather than start threads posting about that low probability, and pissing off my fellow forum members, I'd rather post about the positive stuff, whatever it may be. Because, right or wrong, it's a lot more fun having hope and being positive than rubbing people's noses in negativity.

I agree with everything you say here. Want to point out however that your expectations might be a bit on the high side when it comes to some fellow forum members caring in any way about the board/community harmony and positive discourse.

 

[Plum Street]

I agree with everything you say here. Want to point out however that your expectations might be a bit on the high side when it comes to some fellow forum members caring in any way about the board/community harmony and positive discourse.

I would agree . It’s just a tad bit high !

 

[kupuna133]

That was a tough listen. And it had little to do with the 150 f-bombs for no reason.

 

[RUnTeX]

That was a tough listen. And it had little to do with the 150 f-bombs for no reason.

Part 2 was tougher than than the rather low bar set in Part 1. I didn't think it was possible for MBV to keep digging but he proved me wrong.

Aside from a nugget here and there, didn't see much value in the particular stories shared.

 

[mildone_rivals]

I agree with everything you say here. Want to point out however that your expectations might be a bit on the high side when it comes to some fellow forum members caring in any way about the board/community harmony and positive discourse.

I don't actually have any expectations for board harmony and positivity and wouldn't want anybody to change their posting habits. I like the variety and am not troubled by "realist" or "negatoid" posting.

I'm mostly just explaining to @Plum Street why people, who understand intellectually that a hire is far from ideal, will often publicly argue otherwise. I remember being pretty vocally negative about hiring Flood when GS left for Tampa Bay. But, IIRC, I dropped the negativity pretty quickly and switched to mostly hopeful and supportive posts. Because we were stuck with him, so why be hopeless and miserable and why drag everyone down?

I also didn't do an "I told you so" forum tour when Flood was fired. Because lame.

 

[TonyVolt]

Finally listening to this and the dude Vinny telling the juggs story sounds sort of ridiculous. So there was faulty equipment (that should be pretty basic at any high school team) and when it repeatedly didn’t work he got pissed at the guy who led the equipment managers? I sort of get that and don’t see much wrong with it.

Don’t get me wrong -- Ash was an incompetent douche. No one agrees with that more than me. But this interview isn’t providing a glimpse into anything all that unusual.

This interview was the biggest waste of my time. The kid Vinny sounds like a complete moron with the IQ of an acorn. He’s a terrible representation of Rutgers. University.

 

[Plum Street]

I don't actually have any expectations for board harmony and positivity and wouldn't want anybody to change their posting habits. I like the variety and am not troubled by "realist" or "negatoid" posting.

I'm mostly just explaining to @Plum Street why people, who understand intellectually that a hire is far from ideal, will often publicly argue otherwise. I remember being pretty vocally negative about hiring Flood when GS left for Tampa Bay. But, IIRC, I dropped the negativity pretty quickly and switched to mostly hopeful and supportive posts. Because we were stuck with him, so why be hopeless and miserable and why drag everyone down?

I also didn't do an "I told you so" forum tour when Flood was fired. Because lame.

You don’t need to explain. You were wrong about ash and figured he would win . We stunk ! Continue to hope for the best with GS. That’s what I am doing . We are on the right path

 

[mildone_rivals]

You don’t need to explain. You were wrong about ash and figured he would win . We stunk ! Continue to hope for the best with GS. That’s what I am doing . We are on the right path

Weak troll. Got anything else?

 

[Plum Street]

Weak troll. Got anything else?

Please just put me on ignore . You’re obviously following my posts and trying to prove you’re right . No one else is doing this. Knight stink learned and put me on ignore . You should do the same.

 

[rucoe89]

The TL;DR: Ash stunk and was arrogant. Schiano has us on the right path. Everyone has a different view of someone else's recollection and history and apparently that matters.

Am I caught up?

 

[Knight Shift]

The TL;DR: Ash stunk and was arrogant. Schiano has us on the right path. Everyone has a different view of someone else's recollection and history and apparently that matters.

Am I caught up?

If you listened to part 2, you would learn that the f-bomb is a verb, an adverb, a noun, a pronoun, and an adjective, sometimes in the same sentence!

 

[kupuna133]

Part 2 was tougher than than the rather low bar set in Part 1. I didn't think it was possible for MBV to keep digging but he proved me wrong.

Aside from a nugget here and there, didn't see much value in the particular stories shared.

I took it as a kid with very little real world experience trying to prove he belongs or was there. He just doesn't know what he doesn't know yet. And that could be very dangerous. He would be better off keeping quiet.

 

[Randal7]

Not everybody’s cup of tea. Haha

 

[mildone_rivals]

Please just put me on ignore . You’re obviously following my posts and trying to prove you’re right . No one else is doing this. Knight stink learned and put me on ignore . You should do the same.

Nah. You put me on ignore, if you have a problem. I never put anybody on ignore because I have no problem with anyone.

And I couldn’t care less about “proving I’m right”, whatever that even means.

 

[czxqa]

you were a douche, his logic and reasoning was sound so more than a 'broken clock' but as a douche, you won't see that. Many of you owe him an apology for being a......douche

HIs logic was "he has never been a head coach and I wanted Al Golden." That's not sound reasoning, he was more lucky than right, and the only douche here is you.

 

[Plum Street]

HIs logic was "he has never been a head coach and I wanted Al Golden." That's not sound reasoning, he was more lucky than right, and the only douche here is you.

So now it’s not good enough to be right , you also need “sound logic” ? You are ridiculous . I said at the time ash was a terrible hire because he never was a HC and Rutgers was obviously being cheap with the hire. I didn’t know at the time ash was a complete lazy turd that thought he could just use this place as a stepping stone. No one did

 

[czxqa]

So now it’s not good enough to be right , you also need “sound logic” ? You are ridiculous . I said at the time ash was a terrible hire because he never was a HC and Rutgers was obviously being cheap with the hire. I didn’t know at the time ash was a complete lazy turd that thought he could just use this place as a stepping stone. No one did

Whoa! Hold on a minute. I'm not the one who brought the "sound logic" argument up. But you should expect that if you're going to constantly bring it up, people are going to give you the business a little bit. Comes with the territory.

 

[RUTGERS95]

HIs logic was "he has never been a head coach and I wanted Al Golden." That's not sound reasoning, he was more lucky than right, and the only douche here is you.

nah, he went into a lot more than that but aside from being a douche, apparently you can't read and think. You see, you are worst kind of douche, one that has no idea you're actually being a douche

 

[RUTGERS95]

So now it’s not good enough to be right , you also need “sound logic” ? You are ridiculous . I said at the time ash was a terrible hire because he never was a HC and Rutgers was obviously being cheap with the hire. I didn’t know at the time ash was a complete lazy turd that thought he could just use this place as a stepping stone. No one did

there was basis for your initial assertion which you did follow up on in this thread and others at the time. they are there, we just need someone to go back and find them. I remember them well and found it funny that people would argue in favor of someone with zero basis for that support other than, 'smarter people than me hired him' lol

 

[Plum Street]

there was basis for your initial assertion which you did follow up on in this thread and others at the time. they are there, we just need someone to go back and find them. I remember them well and found it funny that people would argue in favor of someone with zero basis for that support other than, 'smarter people than me hired him' lol

Yes . That these imbeciles are coming here and arguing with me still . Now the narrative has changed to …”well, you made a lucky guess or we all knew ash would suck but we are an optimistic bunch and care about board harmony “.
What a load of BS being spewed . The guy sucked . I predicted it . We got a game in a week with the greatest coach this program can have now . Go RU!

 

[RU_DIO]

My initial reaction was I don't want to listen. Why rehash a train wreck? But I listened, and it is good.

I met Ash early in his tenure at a donor event. He was dismissive and arrogant. I literally wanted to berate and/or slug the guy. As Vinny said, "He didn't know how to connect with people."

Not long after Ash started, I met one of the guys who used to work on the sidelines during the Schiano era who stayed on with Flood. I don't know the guy's name. But if you watch game videos when you would recognize him. He was an older guy. We sat next to his booth at Henry's diner, and I asked him if he was still working for the football team. The guy unloaded on me with a barrage about Ash.

I'm disappointed in you.

You should have kicked his *** back to Iowa.

 

[mildone_rivals]

Yes . That these imbeciles are coming here and arguing with me still . Now the narrative has changed to …”well, you made a lucky guess or we all knew ash would suck but we are an optimistic bunch and care about board harmony “.
What a load of BS being spewed . The guy sucked . I predicted it . We got a game in a week with the greatest coach this program can have now . Go RU!

I am predicting that we will all die one day. I'm going to start lots of threads with titles like: "You're All Going To Die - Many Of You Painfully and Miserably".

What a pure genius I must be for predicting that. And what imbeciles everybody else is for not wanting to talk about it.

Oh, and whenever someone dies, I plan to create a thread in which I nominate myself as Board Genius for having made my amazing prediction, while I denounce those who fail to worship me.

 

[Plum Street]

I am predicting that we will all die one day. I'm going to start lots of threads with titles like: "You're All Going To Die - Many Of You Painfully and Miserably".

What a pure genius I must be for predicting that. And what imbeciles everybody else is for not wanting to talk about it.

Oh, and whenever someone dies, I plan to create a thread in which I nominate myself as Board Genius for having made my amazing prediction, while I denounce those who fail to worship me.

Omg. You’re the slow one in the group

 

[TonyVolt]

Can we just stick to how stupid this guy Vinny is and how terrible this podcast is?

 

[mildone_rivals]

Omg. You’re the slow one in the group

...he says as the message flies right over his head.

 

[Plum Street]

...he says as the message flies right over his head.

You want to compare chris ash and rutgers football to people dying . Trying to be sarcastic with an epic fail .You’re a fool. Please put me on ignore and stop trolling.

 

[Randal7]

Can we just stick to how stupid this guy Vinny is and how terrible this podcast is?

Thanks for the support Tony!

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

the problem here is too many think they have a clue when all they have is hot air and empty space between the ears. No one should give anyone a pass and the notion it takes years to right a ship is nonsensical. I couldn't stand reading, 'he needs at least 5yrs to address what Flood did this program' lol....

Great post. And it doesn’t even end here. When you try to counter this point those same people spin it that your defense of Flood RELATIVE to Ash is really an attempt to make a case that Flood did a “good job” as coach. Ridiculous. Everyone agrees Flood made critical mistakes and needed to go at the time he was fired.

I agree with you and others who have commented that extremes like this (Tales from the Ash) are needed to differentiate just how devastating the Ash hire was for the RU program. To group him alongside a guy who comparatively deserves to be remembered as a very good OL coach and key contributor on the coaching staff during the first Schiano era and who was simply thrown into a situation where he was in over his head - no prior experience, poor leadership and limited funding to work with to build the program is wrong. Because Ash didn’t just “fail”. Due to his arrogance, he also destroyed the remnants of the brand that Schiano had worked to build. This is why, bringing Schiano himself back was the only way to restore that.

 

[Randal7]

Great post. And it doesn’t even end here. When you try to counter this point those same people spin it that your defense of Flood RELATIVE to Ash is really an attempt to make a case that Flood did a “good job” as coach. Ridiculous. Everyone agrees Flood made critical mistakes and needed to go at the time he was fired.

I agree with you and others who have commented that extremes like this (Tales from the Ash) are needed to differentiate just how devastating the Ash hire was for the RU program. To group him alongside a guy who comparatively deserves to be remembered as a very good OL coach and key contributor on the coaching staff during the first Schiano era and who was simply thrown into a situation where he was in over his head - no prior experience, poor leadership and limited funding to work with to build the program is wrong. Because Ash didn’t just “fail”. Due to his arrogance, he also destroyed the remnants of the brand that Schiano had worked to build. This is why, bringing Schiano himself back was the only way to restore that.

Yes. Whether people like the storyteller (Vinny) or the platform (BWST) is really irrelevant. Those stories needed to be told. Weve been under this shroud of mystery about Ash's blatant incompetence. And why?! Who's protecting him?

Why do we come to this site? Why do we spend hours seeking out information? To understand the inside story. The sanitized versions you get from other places (NJ.com, 247) ....thats all BS. That's not gonna tell you anything.

For those who are offended; sorry. I'm not asking for your permission. I'm gonna keep producing this content. There's more to come.

 

[mildone_rivals]

Yes. Whether people like the storyteller (Vinny) or the platform (BWST) is really irrelevant. Those stories needed to be told. Weve been under this shroud of mystery about Ash's blatant incompetence. And why?! Who's protecting him?

Why do we come to this site? Why do we spend hours seeking out information? To understand the inside story. The sanitized versions you get from other places (NJ.com, 247) ....thats all BS. That's not gonna tell you anything.

For those who are offended; sorry. I'm not asking for your permission. I'm gonna keep producing this content. There's more to come.

Who is offended? Unless I missed it, nobody in this thread appears offended at all.

I would point out that there could be as many different reasons for participating in this site as there are people participating. One of the many reasons I come here is for current factual information about the football program. But my interest in such information is mostly limited to what’s happening now, or possibly happening soon. I’m just not that interested in rehashing history.

Each to their own, right?

 

[Scarlet16e2]

Yes. Whether people like the storyteller (Vinny) or the platform (BWST) is really irrelevant. Those stories needed to be told. Weve been under this shroud of mystery about Ash's blatant incompetence. And why?! Who's protecting him?

Why do we come to this site? Why do we spend hours seeking out information? To understand the inside story. The sanitized versions you get from other places (NJ.com, 247) ....thats all BS. That's not gonna tell you anything.

For those who are offended; sorry. I'm not asking for your permission. I'm gonna keep producing this content. There's more to come.

I'm pretty sure everyone had a pretty good idea about Ash's problems. No shroud of mystery. I never heard anyone suggest that our offensive woes were McNulty's fault.

Stories like Vinnie's are out there about all coaches, Schiano included (remember the story about him tearing the dining hall staff a new one over how the eggs were prepared). I just don't think that Vinnie had any special insight into Ash's incompetence. We all knew it - even at the time.

However, putting that aside, I generally enjoy your podcast so by all means keep it up!

 

[mildone_rivals]

You want to compare chris ash and rutgers football to people dying . Trying to be sarcastic with an epic fail .You’re a fool. Please put me on ignore and stop trolling.

It’s pretty ironic that you’re calling me a fool while simultaneously making it clear you can’t differentiate between what I wrote, which was satire, and a serious comparison. Like I said, you missed the point entirely.

You can put whomever you wish on ignore. That’s entirely up to you. I don’t put anybody on ignore.

It’s a sports forum. You’re going to get dissenting opinion and argument. I can take dissenting opinion and am not the least bit troubled by your weak personal insults. Seems you can dish it out but can’t take it. Lame.

 

[Randal7]

I'm pretty sure everyone had a pretty good idea about Ash's problems. No shroud of mystery. I never heard anyone suggest that our offensive woes were McNulty's fault.

Stories like Vinnie's are out there about all coaches, Schiano included (remember the story about him tearing the dining hall staff a new one over how the eggs were prepared). I just don't think that Vinnie had any special insight into Ash's incompetence. We all knew it - even at the time.

However, putting that aside, I generally enjoy your podcast so by all means keep it up!

If "everyone" had a good idea, I wasn't one of those people. Not saying I'm an insider, by any stretch. But, there's alot of things here which are assumed as fact and it's not quite on target.

Appreciate the feedback! I wasn't aiming my critique at you, specifically.

 

[anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy]

I don't know how any of his players could possibly have been inspired by his constipated looks on the sidelines during games.

They all hated him. I havent spoken to one former player who liked or even respected him

 

[Scarlet16e2]

They all hated him. I havent spoken to one former player who liked or even respected him

Just to play devils advocate...are there coaches with losing teams that are liked by most of their players?

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

I'm pretty sure everyone had a pretty good idea about Ash's problems. No shroud of mystery. I never heard anyone suggest that our offensive woes were McNulty's fault.

Stories like Vinnie's are out there about all coaches, Schiano included (remember the story about him tearing the dining hall staff a new one over how the eggs were prepared). I just don't think that Vinnie had any special insight into Ash's incompetence. We all knew it - even at the time.

However, putting that aside, I generally enjoy your podcast so by all means keep it up!

I’d agree with you if some folks didn’t continue to say that Ash was doomed to fail based on what he inherited. It bothers me to still hear that. I truly believe that if Schiano (or any halfway decent coach) had replaced Flood in 2016 they would’ve won at least 5 or 6 games - surely not a complete embarrassment losing 78-0 to Michigan and nearly putting Ruth Chris out of business. Flood should be remembered as a guy who did good things for RU early in his career and was then put in a role that was way over his head because RU leadership cheaped out. RU should’ve learned from it without much collateral damage and that would be that. Instead we got Ash…

 

[Randal7]

Just to play devils advocate...are there coaches with losing teams that are liked by most of their players?

Flood was generally liked

 

[Plum Street]

It’s pretty ironic that you’re calling me a fool while simultaneously making it clear you can’t differentiate between what I wrote, which was satire, and a serious comparison. Like I said, you missed the point entirely.

You can put whomever you wish on ignore. That’s entirely up to you. I don’t put anybody on ignore.

It’s a sports forum. You’re going to get dissenting opinion and argument. I can take dissenting opinion and am not the least bit troubled by your weak personal insults. Seems you can dish it out but can’t take it. Lame.

Yes , it was a lame attempt at sarcasm . Fail! That’s why nobody is liking your posts or responding to you except me here .
What exactly are you dissenting ?

 

[kupuna133]

Yes. Whether people like the storyteller (Vinny) or the platform (BWST) is really irrelevant. Those stories needed to be told. Weve been under this shroud of mystery about Ash's blatant incompetence. And why?! Who's protecting him?

Why do we come to this site? Why do we spend hours seeking out information? To understand the inside story. The sanitized versions you get from other places (NJ.com, 247) ....thats all BS. That's not gonna tell you anything.

For those who are offended; sorry. I'm not asking for your permission. I'm gonna keep producing this content. There's more to come.

I enjoy your podcast and was not offended by Vinny in the least. My only comment is that I am not sure that Vinny is mature or articulate enough to relay the message or offer insight. As I said earlier in the thread, nothing against Vinny but he doesn't know what he doesn't know. And that in of itself is very dangerous.

 

[anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy]

Just to play devils advocate...are there coaches with losing teams that are liked by most of their players?

Yes. Kyle Flood. Most the guys on the team contrary to popular belief actually liked him