For the first time since Bannon or maybe longer...

[Loyal_2RU]

I feel like we will be getting these Rivals 50, Rivals 100, and Rivals 150 players who take hard looks to actually come here.

This staff ahs a different it factor than any other we have had before.

And I remember in the Tom Young era always being runner up for our top recruits to frickin' Villanova.

It's been a long time since I felt an easy optimism about the future of hoops on the banks.

Peace out,
Loyal

 

[cyrock3]

We've gotten them before. This is not new territory.

 

[Russ Wood]

Eddie Jordan got at least one Top 100 player so it really hasn't been that long ago

 

[80RU]

I feel like we will be getting these Rivals 50, Rivals 100, and Rivals 150 players who take hard looks to actually come here.

This staff ahs a different it factor than any other we have had before.

And I remember in the Tom Young era always being runner up for our top recruits to frickin' Villanova.

It's been a long time since I felt an easy optimism about the future of hoops on the banks.

Peace out,
Loyal

But TY did beat Villanova out for a guy 'Nova wanted badly in Jeff Allen – – and they had to settle for John Pinone.

 

[Scarlet Shack]

I feel like we will be getting these Rivals 50, Rivals 100, and Rivals 150 players who take hard looks to actually come here.

This staff ahs a different it factor than any other we have had before.

And I remember in the Tom Young era always being runner up for our top recruits to frickin' Villanova.

It's been a long time since I felt an easy optimism about the future of hoops on the banks.

Peace out,
Loyal

Same with my thought

First time we have really been in the recruiting game since bannon (which, in retrospect, was partially because he had a really good staff)

We have a real shot here

 

[bigmatt718]

I feel like we will be getting these Rivals 50, Rivals 100, and Rivals 150 players who take hard looks to actually come here.

This staff ahs a different it factor than any other we have had before.

And I remember in the Tom Young era always being runner up for our top recruits to frickin' Villanova.

It's been a long time since I felt an easy optimism about the future of hoops on the banks.

Peace out,
Loyal

Hear, hear!!

 

[Hamilton's Cannon]

Honestly, I feel one of Bannon's greatest strengths was identifying under the radar talent. Rashod Kent, limited as his game could be, played way above his regard coming in, IMO.

 

[Zak57]

Pike has me excited but Jordan got one and Rice's first class was nationally rated very high don't forget.

 

[Loyal_2RU]

Pike has me excited but Jordan got one and Rice's first class was nationally rated very high don't forget.

Fair points in the thread.

I have nothing bad to say about Eddie Jordan, who is a Rutgers man who just didn't get it done here. No shame in trying.

Still, I am talking about how this staff makes me feel, that we have a shot at competing in the recruiting game near the highest level. Not Kentucky or Duke, but not also pulling in a single guy. Recruiting a high level class, year after year. That's how it feels. We'll see what tomorrow brings...
Loyal

 

[GoodOl'Rutgers]

Sadly I am reminded of how we offered Jay Wright.. but then Nova fired rat-face and offered Wright his dream job.... and I wondered.. did our AD.. Mulcahy..a Nova guy.. was he at all responsible for Nova making that move? Did we have a handshake deal with Wright?

 

[Scangg]

Pike has me excited but Jordan got one and Rice's first class was nationally rated very high don't forget.

Fair points in the thread.

I have nothing bad to say about Eddie Jordan, who is a Rutgers man who just didn't get it done here. No shame in trying.

Still, I am talking about how this staff makes me feel, that we have a shot at competing in the recruiting game near the highest level. Not Kentucky or Duke, but not also pulling in a single guy. Recruiting a high level class, year after year. That's how it feels. We'll see what tomorrow brings...
Loyal

Did he try though? Eddie took a really tough job after rice left but from what I've heard on the board here he was almost invisible on the recruiting trail. That soured me on Eddie

 

[bowlgoal]

Eddie, no good. Pikiell was ready for this job and he will succeed.

 

[Loyal_2RU]

Did he try though? Eddie took a really tough job after rice left but from what I've heard on the board here he was almost invisible on the recruiting trail. That soured me on Eddie

Don't want to make this thread about Eddie, his virtues or his shortcomings. The fit didn't work. Can we leave it at that. His emotion after the Wisconsin game convinced me that he cared and was doing his best, whatever it is that led to him not to succeed here.

 

[bowlgoal]

Bottom line is that the program wasn't ready to succeed under any of these coaches. It went downhill after wenzel left and although the downhill was slower with Bannon and Waters; it was headed in the wrong direction.

Hobbs; with the full support of the President has the ability to succeed, the ability to raise money and the financial security that's here because of the big 10 money we will have.

I give Hobbs all the credit for choosing Pikiell. I'll be the first to admit I was not on board because I knew nothing about him. I don't have an ounce of doubt that this guy is the right choice.

I fully agree that the Eddie era is over and done so we should turn the page and not go back in time.

 

[Scangg]

I love Hobbs. I love Pike. Everything just feels different. I haven't said this about any other coach at Rutgers but I am so confident in the future success of the Rutgers Basketball program and it is only going to keep getting better

 

[SkilletHead2]

Sadly I am reminded of how we offered Jay Wright.. but then Nova fired rat-face and offered Wright his dream job.... and I wondered.. did our AD.. Mulcahy..a Nova guy.. was he at all responsible for Nova making that move? Did we have a handshake deal with Wright?

Gotta figure Wright woulda been a one and done anyway when Nova offered. This is not so much spilt milk as there was next to no milk in the bottle in the first place.

 

[KevH]

Lo

Honestly, I feel one of Bannon's greatest strengths was identifying under the radar talent. Rashod Kent, limited as his game could be, played way above his regard coming in, IMO.

Loved Kent. He was more than a handful for opponents.

 

[G- RUnit]

Honestly, I feel one of Bannon's greatest strengths was identifying under the radar talent. Rashod Kent, limited as his game could be, played way above his regard coming in, IMO.

Wasn't Quincy Douby an initial Bannon find too...

 

[Knights 1212]

I don't think so. I believe Douby never played basketball in high school until his junior or senior year when the coach saw him shooting in the gym after school one day and encouraged him to try out for the team.

 

[seels2662]

For two seasons FHJ had five Rivals top 150 guys on the same team:

07-08:Rosario, Ech, Hamaday, JR Inman, Corey Chandler
08-09:Rosario, Ech, Hamaday, Mitchell and Dane Miller

He went 26-38 in those two seasons.

 

[bowlgoal]

Bannon played the most vanilla, boring basketball you could watch. We would be down 10 with 3 minutes to go and he still refused to press on defense. Dahntay jones was his best achievement but only lasted two seasons. Rob Hodgeson was a solid player and Todd Billet as well but the coaching was very mediocre.

Waters couldn't recruit enough talent. He got to NIT finals one year but not many remember that the path to get there included a bunch of home games that weren't that challenging. It was still nice to get to post season. If Jones would have stayed things could have been more interesting. Good dresser, nice suits and a good guy.

I thought Rice was really close to rebuilding and I won't even mention Freddie hill because his stint was a disaster. Mark my words on Rice. He will be given another chance and be back in the college game. He's doing an amazing job in high school right now. He just needs someone to take a chance.

No need to get into Eddie.


Pikiell has "it." Aside from the fact that kids clearly enjoy playing for him which is apparent; he can coach. He has an offense and several different defenses that he mixes in throughout the game. He also scouts and prepares very well against each opponent. We had several games that were very close and guys who didn't know how to win and we pulled out a few good ones last year. Now we know that talent wise we were short and that is about to change. Not to mention that his guys really contributed last year and I think Geo will really shine in this program along with Kiss. I don't know much about Mensah but I trust in Steve that he saw all he needed to see.

Buy your season tickets now. Before you know it this place will be sold out on a regular basis

 

[seels2662]

Eddie Jordan got at least one Top 100 player so it really hasn't been that long ago

Jordan actually got (unofficially) FOUR Rivals top 150 guys: Etou, Sanders, and DJ Foreman. Freeman was one of 110 or so four or five stars in the 2015 recruiting class but he got his rating after the last Rivals 150 list came out.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

I don't care the amount of Top 150 players we land. Looking at history it means nothing.

I want guys that will help build the program. If they happen to be from Top 150, great.

I am not convinced that over the next 5 years there is a positive correlation between Top 150 recruits and potential success on the court.

The post above is exhibit A

 

[RU85inFla]

Screw the ranking of the recruits. Pickell has done what others have not been able to do except Rice for 1 year. He has gotten the team to play above expectations. That is what a good coach does.

 

[4theknights]

Its easy to get bogged down with rankings, four stars, top 150 and the like. The important part is the development of the player once he arrives and how he becomes a part of building the program. With Pike and staff, we have the pieces in place to develop players. The turn around in rebounding and defense and of course effort was solid last year. I look forward to see how players like Baker, Johnson develop this year as well as Thiam/Eugene building off last year.

 

[higgins3]

Always like seeing the history here, even if its not positive history. I became a fan when I stepped on campus in 2011. What a place to go to school. Bullish on the trend.

Buy,buy,buy!

I don't care the amount of Top 150 players we land. Looking at history it means nothing.

I want guys that will help build the program. If they happen to be from Top 150, great.

I am not convinced that over the next 5 years there is a positive correlation between Top 150 recruits and potential success on the court.

The post above is exhibit A

Can you name ten programs who have won at a high level and not recruited and landed top 150-200 talent?

You mix and match. It takes a correct building process. That is what the staff is doing. You have to have a balance.

 

[Loyal_2RU]

Screw the ranking of the recruits. Pickell has done what others have not been able to do except Rice for 1 year. He has gotten the team to play above expectations. That is what a good coach does.

I would say that Waters did this well. He had an unfortunate moment (actually Kevin Heck did) early on the recruiting trail that turned a lot of important folks off and was slowly recovering from that. Unfortunately, there was a Mulcahy/FHJ coup and whatever was positive about the hoops program under Waters was gone.

And I don't mean to re-open the 'would Waters ultimately have gotten it done here' debate. Only that the trajectory went down and not up from there.

 

[RUBigFrank]

Waters was on the right track - and proven track record after he left RU.

Shame that he derailed - seems that the administration wanted Fred Hill Jr in place and took advantage of the circumstances.

 

[RUJMM78]

We've gotten them before. This is not new territory.

Yes, that is true but too many transferred after 2 years.

 

[Loyal_2RU]

We've gotten them before. This is not new territory.

I don't remember this feeling. Like we belonged at the table for these kids. Not that we were dating up.
Loyal

 

[NewJerseyHawk]

Recruiting rankings only matter to fans, but recruiting to the style of how you play matter more....the pieces fit and there are multiple options that are similar for 3 spots right now.

Fans looking at only the 150 are foolish in comparing what's happening now....There were more kids that were well beyond a Top 400 to 500 to not even on the radar that were mixed with some top 150 kids OR there was overlap of skill sets....in this case the targets even if they are not "top 150", they are not way beyond that area talent-wise.

Finding and developing a recruiting balance is more critical than a teams final rankings....the targets we are looking at can play or function at multiple positions well and their game translates better at this level. That's a key component to RU's struggles in the past was not having a recruit developed, or we truly lacked the strength and conditioning etc....things that are being corrected and in place to grow the program.

Facilities coming, improved and true strength and conditioning, better flexibility with targets that can play multiple positions reduces your risk and increases your success to recruit.....add to that a true coaching staff from 1-4, & they are all pieces to the puzzle....I've had people who don't watch basketball say it's night and day from years past and clearly visible from Game 1 through the end of Season 1 with Pike and this staff.....it's only going to improve.

The success is the combination of assistants and Pike together that makes this improvement happen. The roster last year was not a completed roster and they got miles of production not expected out of it. That's enough for me to know we are set up nicely for the next couple of years.

 

[RUChoppin]

Even if you are looking at Top 150 guys, you have to get the *right* top 150 guys. While plenty of Top 150 guys end up being "misses" every year, one would like to think that it's a lower percentage than lower rated guys. The assumption is that the higher a player is rated, the less likely they are to be a "miss".

So, even within the top 150, the Top 10 guys would likely be better bets than 11-50, than 51-100, etc.

And to Hawk's point, a guy who fits perfectly into the puzzle for a certain team/coach might not have the overall rating... but he's a better choice for a certain role than guys who are much more highly regarded.

It comes down to evaluation of the individual player. A guy outside the Top 150 might very well end up as a much stronger performer than a guy inside it, or a better fit within a certain role. But back to the above assumption, the Top 150 (or top 50, or whatever) guys may have a better shot at performing at a high level overall.

That said, here are how many Rivals 150 players were listed as committing to each school in the conference over the last 4 seasons (2014-2017):

11 - Michigan St, Ohio St
9 - Maryland
8 - Indiana, Purdue
7 - Illinois, Nebraska
6 - Michigan, Minnesota
5 - Wisconsin
4 - Northwestern, Iowa, PA St
2 - Rutgers

On one hand, we've clearly secured commitments from fewer such players than our conference mates.... on the other, the relative positions of Ohio St and Northwestern show that number of Top 150 commitments doesn't necessarily align to on court performance.

 

[batts]

Douby was a highly sought after recruit. Waters out recruited Louis Orr for Douby.

Mulcahy got word that SHU was going to name Freddy Hill as an assistant coach so he hired Hill out from under SHU and then made an excuse to fire Waters. Waters was a good coach who didn't recruit all that well. He was also a fine person who got screwed by Mulcahy,

Orr was an excellent coach but a lazy recruiter. He also refused to participate in events for boosters and alumni. .

 

[TDIrish27]

Douby signed with Hofstra ------what happened after that goes according to who you speak to.

 

[PatrickRU92]

I'm going to keep repeating this until I'm blue in the face I think--I happened to have liked GW when I met him--but he did not have RU on the right track. He was at RU for 5 years with no NCAA to speak of, and the 6th year was going to be awful. we had for the 1st time in ages a bonafide 1st round NBA player and we still couldn't parlay that into an NCAA bid. Douby was not a super high recruit, he blossomed late IIRC. Beating SHOE and SJU for a recruit back then was not that big a deal like it would have been since we really took a dump into the crapper after the Rice fiasco.

The thing is after GW things got worse so people are always pining for those "good ol' days" where we were competitive. Don't let our more recent disasters cloud your judgement on GW. He took over an RU program that was not great, but not a bottom feeder either. And he didn't get us to the NCAAs in 5 years and the the 6th year, had he stayed , would have been his least talented team ever due to his complete inability to recruit.

Argue over how he was fired if you must. I personally was very disappointed he went to Kent and missed our game when we all knew inclement weather was on the way. Doesn't change that fact that he would have had 6 years with no NCAA in sight

He got his chance, he didn't succeed, it was time to move on.

 

[scarletrat]

If we want to "compare" coaches, the closest we came to NCAAs and building a legitimate program was under Bannon. Not even that close IMO. He coached and his teams played an edge that we need. Just self-destructed, and Jones and T Billet left.

 

[Greene Rice FIG]

Always like seeing the history here, even if its not positive history. I became a fan when I stepped on campus in 2011. What a place to go to school. Bullish on the trend.

Buy,buy,buy!


Can you name ten programs who have won at a high level and not recruited and landed top 150-200 talent?

You mix and match. It takes a correct building process. That is what the staff is doing. You have to have a balance.

No I can't.

I am looking at building the program to eventually win. Realistic to know winning at a high level is a process.

Again, it is most likely than not that today a top 150 kid we land has warts. You have to realize and respect where we are at on the totem poll TODAY.

 

[higgins3]

No I can't.

I am looking at building the program to eventually win. Realistic to know winning at a high level is a process.

Again, it is most likely than not that today a top 150 kid we land has warts. You have to realize and respect where we are at on the totem poll TODAY.

No I can't.

I am looking at building the program to eventually win. Realistic to know winning at a high level is a process.

Again, it is most likely than not that today a top 150 kid we land has warts. You have to realize and respect where we are at on the totem poll TODAY.

Not every 200 kid has issues. Pikiell has the balance working now.

 

[Loyal_2RU]

No I can't.

I am looking at building the program to eventually win. Realistic to know winning at a high level is a process.

Again, it is most likely than not that today a top 150 kid we land has warts. You have to realize and respect where we are at on the totem poll TODAY.

This is where I disagree. I think that had been true for a long time. What this staff has changed is that in the current environment we can recruit top line guys who plan to be in college for a while.
Loyal

 

[RU_DIO]

Douby was a highly sought after recruit. Waters out recruited Louis Orr for Douby.

Mulcahy got word that SHU was going to name Freddy Hill as an assistant coach so he hired Hill out from under SHU and then made an excuse to fire Waters. Waters was a good coach who didn't recruit all that well. He was also a fine person who got screwed by Mulcahy,

Orr was an excellent coach but a lazy recruiter. He also refused to participate in events for boosters and alumni. .

I agree with all of this. The rumor was Waters was going to coach for two more years and then be moved out. It happened 1 year sooner.

Orr was loved by his players, at least the ones I knew. My friend who played for you guys under Orr and Gonzo hated Gonzo.