Covid 5.0

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NorthwoodHusker

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If true that’s scary, because if a communist country where individual rights are practically non-existent can’t get it shut down, how will we?
Understand, with no antibodies, its going to keep going, until theres a vaccine or antibodies.
 

MOHUSKER

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Glad Hillary hopes you're one then? Or, if you are one, she's part of her joke. Defend that.
Theres a few things I wont defend of Trump, but this is about a world wide crisis, and she fiddles to her crowd who enjoys the sound, as the world burns.


And so has Trump, literally just said he’s upset because people aren’t grateful enough. His advisors are saying we have a while to go while Donald touts we’re open for business again soon. At least Biden appears genuinely confused, Trump lies pathologically to his base and they eat it up without a thought or sliver of common sense.
 

Headcard

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Glad Hillary hopes you're one then? Or, if you are one, she's part of her joke. Defend that.
Theres a few things I wont defend of Trump, but this is about a world wide crisis, and she fiddles to her crowd who enjoys the sound, as the world burns.
Maybe he’s not defending Hillary, instead he’s pointing out that Trump does this crap all the time and you find ways to make excuses for him over and over.
 

NorthwoodHusker

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The current one is blamed because he was told clearly in January that this had pandemic possibilities. Nobody expects the US to have 1 million ventilators but they do expect the fed to protect the nation in the case of a pandemic, especially when it comes to a supplies that are to be used by the nation as a whole. It is obvious he didn't have a clue, he recognized that the steps that China took were crazy and weren't going to happen here...he doesn't have a science background and generally is SLOW to listen. I would have actually had a stroke had he done this thing in a sensible way because he doesn't do things in a sensible manner, this can work sometimes and other times it leaders to thousands of preventable deaths. We are about 3 weeks from seeing if his negligence caused thousands of deaths or if the virus is weaker than we suppose...remember he knows he can shoot someone in times square and still have followers...so he won't lose believers no matter what...
Thats fine, but everyone who's responsible dropped the ball from ,or after Bush on.
That fact these numbers were hidden from the publiic, you know ,the doctors who can easily discern those numbers.
Why do we have to have an undisclosed source for those numbers, doesnt that bother you? Why didn't the previous president not take care of this?
Now, our oil reserve was refused too, that ok too? These are national protective issues under guidlines which aren't being met.
But spending monies on art is important, can't forget that?

It doesn't end with this president, and we'd be better off if we were up to guidlines on ventilator numbers.
So, lets just go back to those non guideline numbers? After this?

Boyscouts got better sense than our government.
 

NorthwoodHusker

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And so has Trump, literally just said he’s upset because people aren’t grateful enough. His advisors are saying we have a while to go while Donald touts we’re open for business again soon. At least Biden appears genuinely confused, Trump lies pathologically to his base and they eat it up without a thought or sliver of common sense.
Link that? I havent seen that. My guess is, in context, some in Washington aren't greatful enough to be able in getting the bill passed, like the guy Trump wants out of the repub party from Kentucky.
 

mwulf

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Glad Hillary hopes you're one then? Or, if you are one, she's part of her joke. Defend that.
Theres a few things I wont defend of Trump, but this is about a world wide crisis, and she fiddles to her crowd who enjoys the sound, as the world burns.
 

mwulf

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Haha, no they didn't.
Literally every country, then when I was in Manchester in December the table we sat at had Canadians and South Africans... First question again was "what were you guys thinking when you chose Trump?"
 

jlb321_rivals110621

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It is incredibly easy to put someone on a ventilator - it is incredibly difficult to precisely manage a patient with the degree of lung injury this virus causes such that they have a chance to get off a ventilator.

As an Intensivist is required to mange 10 then 20 then 30+ patients on a ventilator that precision is lost. More ventilators is going to lead to more people placed on ventilators - stuck on ventilators and ultimately dying on ventilators.

I used the analogy before but mass producing a bunch of ventilators and not having enough people to effectively manage them is like mass producing scalpels so you can do more surgery.
 

NorthwoodHusker

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It is incredibly easy to put someone on a ventilator - it is incredibly difficult to precisely manage a patient with the degree of lung injury this virus causes such that they have a chance to get off a ventilator.

As an Intensivist is required to mange 10 then 20 then 30+ patients on a ventilator that precision is lost. More ventilators is going to lead to more people placed on ventilators - stuck on ventilators and ultimately dying on ventilators.

I used the analogy before but mass producing a bunch of ventilators and not having enough people to effectively manage them is like mass producing scalpels so you can do more surgery.
True, but some will learn, numbers or training should be expanded going forwards. Some will get better,those learning to operate in unison per patient, more is better at this point.

Do you have more on post infection lung recovery?
 

Solana Beach Husker

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I can't argue with you anymore other than to say that nobody was afraid of John Kerry...

Name the president...he was war hawk...broke the the sovereignty of 15 nations, killed thousands of people with unmanned drones, led to the rise of Isis and deaths of thousands of innocent people, his pandering to the financial elite lead to a dramatic growth in income inequality, crime rose in the inner cities, public unrest increased, and people had less trust for authority by the end of his 8 years. He created more millionaires while shrinking the middle class, his fracking policies destroyed the environment of many locales while making the U.S energy independent for the first time in 50 years. HIs name was Barack Obama, I voted for him twice and would vote for him again. But he was leftist in title not consequence.
 

HuskerO58

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Literally every country, then when I was in Manchester in December the table we sat at had Canadians and South Africans... First question again was "what were you guys thinking when you chose Trump?"
Only way this happened is if you brought it up Trump first.
 

newAD

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I have more faith in America and Americans.

You have more faith that a free country will be able to more effectively get compliance with a long term quarantine than a communist country where the government enforces whatever it wants? Good luck.
 

NorthwoodHusker

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That question is unanswerable at this time. Not the only Dr who is saying this. That’s an assumption that we don’t know the answer to yet.

https://www.newscentermaine.com/mob...ealth/95-4c939c52-aac0-49b7-9871-54f6df045295
Understood, but its not just staying in place, and more deadly variants are short lived,and die out on their own.
High contagion high mortality rate virii are extremely rare too.
In the end, the virus always faces that double edged sword, like the ultimate trasher, they destroy the world on which they live.
 

jlb321_rivals110621

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True, but some will learn, numbers or training should be expanded going forwards. Some will get better,those learning to operate in unison per patient, more is better at this point.

Do you have more on post infection lung recovery?

the ventilator can cause further lung injury depending on the settings which will vary from patient to patient. You need to protect the lungs with your ventilatory strategy. You can't just tweak the dials to make everything look "normal" or you are going to slowly injure the lungs (barotrauma + volutrauma) and the patient, after having what looks like very good results initially will plateau and then deteriorate into mulitorgan failure from this ventilator induced lung injury and ulimately die.

Sometimes the labs can look really deranged for a time but ultimately this "lung-protective" strategy will give the patient the best chance of survival. On occasion the patient is turned on their stomach and ventilated to facilitate this strategy - proning.

Aside from the ventilator, patients do better with minimal sedation - this has to be finely titrated on a frequent basis by nursing. Patients should be able to rehab on the ventilator - work with physical therapy even walk on occasion while on a ventilator. If this doesn't happen the patient just gets progressively weaker while in bed such that they aren;t strong enough to get off a vent or can be left a neuromuscular cripple. This rehab and sedation approach is incredibly intense and time consuming - it goes out the window when the ICUs are full and nursing ratios are greatly reduced

Fluids in and out have to be precisely controlled - too much fluid injures the lungs
Kidney function maintained
nutrition through a feeding tube
electrolytes routinely checked and replaced
constant surveillance for the development of other infections

and then if the lungs partially recover there comes a time when the breathing tube and ventilator might be able to be removed - this again is a very difficult - you need to test the patient breathing at various levels of less support - observe their breathing pattern - make sure they are awake, etc, etc

this degree of precision cannot be achieved when you are trying to manage 3x the number of ventilators than normal

more ventilators will lead to more people stuck on ventilators because everything needed to get them off cannot be performed when the system is overwhelmed

sticking someone on a ventilator is incredibly easy - getting them off is not
 
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Ewooc

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Did we learn nothing from the last election? Poll don't mean jack. Mainly because most Trump supporters either don't answer them at all or aren't truthful.
 

NorthwoodHusker

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You have more faith that a free country will be able to more effectively get compliance with a long term quarantine than a communist country where the government enforces whatever it wants? Good luck.
So, thr beatings will continue until morale improves always works? It too has its limits, and the results,if thoselimitsare passed or not are not pretty, and rest assured, people in those situations knows this much better than us.
 

mwulf

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Only way this happened is if you brought it up Trump first.
Not at all. Once they hear you are American it's the first question. It was mostly from the guides. I don't even want people to know I am American when I am overseas. In India a 6'2" white guy screams not from here though
 

NorthwoodHusker

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Good, finally, now maybe she will list all herefforts she's made to this point.
Something like: Hello Roche? This is the governor of Michigan, can you send us some PPE or anything on this list of helps I'm faxing you?
Would love to see it.
 

NorthwoodHusker

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Jun 20, 2019
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Not at all. Once they hear you are American it's the first question. It was mostly from the guides. I don't even want people to know I am American when I am overseas. In India a 6'2" white guy screams not from here though
And those same people, I would ask, why are you giving up your liberties by being part of the EU just for money?
Did you ask them about their greed?
 

mwulf

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And those same people, I would ask, why are you giving up your liberties by being part of the EU just for money?
Did you ask them about their greed?
Man last thing I am going to do is insult people that are showing me around their country. Especially in the middle east
 

mwulf

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Only way this happened is if you brought it up Trump first.
There was one guy in Agra who REALLY loved the Romney clan. Couldn't wait to show me pics of himself and Mitt. Couldn't believe why he didn't get elected
 
Jan 10, 2020
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Not at all. Once they hear you are American it's the first question. It was mostly from the guides. I don't even want people to know I am American when I am overseas. In India a 6'2" white guy screams not from here though
I believe it. I went to the Open Championship in N Ireland this past summer and the same happened to me. First question every time.

Hit and miss in London, though.
 
Jan 10, 2020
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And those same people, I would ask, why are you giving up your liberties by being part of the EU just for money?
Did you ask them about their greed?
Lol. Just like one person didn’t elect the pres, they have no say in those matters.

In my experience it was good for a laugh then got on with the conversation, not something that was dwelled on.
 

mwulf

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I believe it. I went to the Open Championship in N Ireland this past summer and the same happened to me. First question every time.

Hit and miss in London, though.
Man I would love to go to the Open. Was it tough finding lodging?
 

mwulf

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Lol. Just like one person didn’t elect the pres, they have no say in those matters.

In my experience it was good for a laugh then got on with the conversation, not something that was dwelled on.
yep every single time just laugh and move on
 
Jan 10, 2020
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Man I would love to go to the Open. Was it tough finding lodging?
It was incredible. Would’ve been impossible to find lodging on-site, but stayed in Belfast and drove the ~50 miles each morning. Wasn’t too bad if you don’t mind getting up early and driving on the left side of the road.

Highly recommend the event, regardless of setting. Top notch all the way.
 

HUSKERFAN66

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Sounds like they're coming up with a lot of ways to make ventilators... CPAP, anesthesia mask etc
 

mwulf

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It was incredible. Would’ve been impossible to find lodging on-site, but stayed in Belfast and drove the ~50 miles each morning. Wasn’t too bad if you don’t mind getting up early and driving on the left side of the road.

Highly recommend the event, regardless of setting. Top notch all the way.
I did Wimbledon back in 2014 and Premier League in December. The Open is on my list when the world is a little more normal
 
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