Just read post about knowing covid victims. For comparison purposes...
- Thread starter Bulldog Bruce
- Start date
I’ve known nobody that died of the flu. I’ve lost two people to COVID this year.
As I’ve said countless times, the death rate is not the issue, it’s the infection rate. So many people are quickly infected it easily spreads to vulnerable populations that would have normally escaped other equally or more deadly diseases.
I guess I’ve been around for 43 flu seasons and I don’t know of anyone that has died from the flu (that’s not to say that I don’t know anyone, it’s just not newsworthy so they may have and I don’t remember.) I know two people that died of COVID in 4 months.
I also asked my wife who worked as a PT in nursing homes for 20 years if she remembers people that died from the flu. She said she doesn’t remember many.
I also asked my wife who worked as a PT in nursing homes for 20 years if she remembers people that died from the flu. She said she doesn’t remember many.
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I suspect most people know people that died of the flu but don’t really think of it as dying of the flu. They were almost certainly people already ok deaths door and susceptible to being killed by the next viral or bacterial infection they got.
Not saying you don’t have a good point. I certainly don’t know of anybody that died of the flu just because they were morbidly obese or had diabetes and I might not know of anybody in their 60’s that died of flu without having something like cancer they were already dealing with, and I think there’s a good chance I will Know somebody that died of Covid that fits one of those descriptions by the time Covid has worked it’s way through the population.
Just pointing out that roughly half of the deaths we’ve had So far would likely look similar to the typical flu deaths we would have in any particular year.
Some read into what I asked. They think I posed the question with an agenda. I asked out of serious curiosity.
I have had 0 for both. I have read the CDC estimations all the previous pandemics and there are some very high numbers. I did not know of anyone to die then, so I was curious if others have experienced that.
I have had 0 for both. I have read the CDC estimations all the previous pandemics and there are some very high numbers. I did not know of anyone to die then, so I was curious if others have experienced that.
1 from covid, buddy of mine since our Saint Richards days.
1 from flu. Was a healthy 45 year old, felt bad went to bed, husband found her struggling to breath the next morning, organs shut down, just a freakish thing.
1 from flu. Was a healthy 45 year old, felt bad went to bed, husband found her struggling to breath the next morning, organs shut down, just a freakish thing.
Both numbers are less than one percent of one percent, so likely not many have. Which is why I'm puzzled that such a big deal is being made, but it is an election year
I have covered this before...Zero deaths on both.
My people don't live long enough to die from the flu. To busy drinking, smoking, fighting, shooting, stabbing, and otherwise misdemeanoring themselves to death before they reach 65.
Through this whole process, I have begun to question the **** out of the flu estimates. Between myself, my wife, and my kids, none of us have had the flu.. Ever. At least not knowingly. We get strep. We get colds. We get all kinds of other weird ****. Never the flu. I read an article a while back where an ER doc in Boston had only witnessed a single flu death in his 10+ years of medicine. So he called other colleagues and they never really saw it either.
I then started looking for famous people that have died from flu/pneumonia and I found about a dozen or so I knew of that have passed in the last 12 years. Stan Lee, R. Lee Ermey, Jake LaMotta, Merle Haggard, Mary Tyler Moore, Norman Schwarzkopf, Jack Lalane, Leslie Nielsen, Corey Haim, Brittany Murphy, and Bernie Mac. Not sure about the others, but Haim had a heart condition that killed him, Brittany Murphy OD'd, and Bernie Mac had a severe lung disease called sarcoidosis. So the flu/pneumonia brings up that how many died "from it vs with it" question you hear about covid.
I know Covid has gotten Joe Diffie, John Prine, Adam Schlesinger, Roy Horn (Seigfried and Roy), Tom Dempsey, and Pat Dye. How many of those were "from covid" vs with it I have not idea. Probably similiar to the flu in that way.
So by the scientific "celebrities I have heard of" death count. I have tallied 11 in 12 years from flu/pneumonia and 6 in as many months from Covid. I would suspect that number will increase a little bit on covid by the end of the year. But its So maybe a 10-1 ratio of reported covid deaths to flu deaths. But I would imagine with all the hype around Covid, its going to make front page news if a Celeb dies from it and that may not have been the case over the years with flu/pneumonia. So it's likely my celebrity death tracker is undercounting flu/pneumonia, but it may balance out again since it appears all pneumonia deaths in flu season are considered flu deaths...
So who the 17 knows.
My people don't live long enough to die from the flu. To busy drinking, smoking, fighting, shooting, stabbing, and otherwise misdemeanoring themselves to death before they reach 65.
Through this whole process, I have begun to question the **** out of the flu estimates. Between myself, my wife, and my kids, none of us have had the flu.. Ever. At least not knowingly. We get strep. We get colds. We get all kinds of other weird ****. Never the flu. I read an article a while back where an ER doc in Boston had only witnessed a single flu death in his 10+ years of medicine. So he called other colleagues and they never really saw it either.
I then started looking for famous people that have died from flu/pneumonia and I found about a dozen or so I knew of that have passed in the last 12 years. Stan Lee, R. Lee Ermey, Jake LaMotta, Merle Haggard, Mary Tyler Moore, Norman Schwarzkopf, Jack Lalane, Leslie Nielsen, Corey Haim, Brittany Murphy, and Bernie Mac. Not sure about the others, but Haim had a heart condition that killed him, Brittany Murphy OD'd, and Bernie Mac had a severe lung disease called sarcoidosis. So the flu/pneumonia brings up that how many died "from it vs with it" question you hear about covid.
I know Covid has gotten Joe Diffie, John Prine, Adam Schlesinger, Roy Horn (Seigfried and Roy), Tom Dempsey, and Pat Dye. How many of those were "from covid" vs with it I have not idea. Probably similiar to the flu in that way.
So by the scientific "celebrities I have heard of" death count. I have tallied 11 in 12 years from flu/pneumonia and 6 in as many months from Covid. I would suspect that number will increase a little bit on covid by the end of the year. But its So maybe a 10-1 ratio of reported covid deaths to flu deaths. But I would imagine with all the hype around Covid, its going to make front page news if a Celeb dies from it and that may not have been the case over the years with flu/pneumonia. So it's likely my celebrity death tracker is undercounting flu/pneumonia, but it may balance out again since it appears all pneumonia deaths in flu season are considered flu deaths...
So who the 17 knows.
COVID 0. Flu several
As I recall, WL baseball coach jerry boatners first wife died from flu.
Also, one reason you might not recall flu deaths is because often it is secondary bacterial pneumonia that is COD which was led to by flu.
As I recall, WL baseball coach jerry boatners first wife died from flu.
Also, one reason you might not recall flu deaths is because often it is secondary bacterial pneumonia that is COD which was led to by flu.
0-COVID
3- flu that led to pneumonia ( including an elderly family member who was in long them care at the time- could have just as easily been COVID this year).
0- flu alone
3- flu that led to pneumonia ( including an elderly family member who was in long them care at the time- could have just as easily been COVID this year).
0- flu alone
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Maybe you should explain this further. You could have had 1 COVID case and no flu case, or 15 COVID-14 FLU cases, or you could have had 20 COVID deaths to no flu deaths witch would make you a pretty bad COVID doctor (assuming you are a doctor).
Everyone apparently knows except for a few people like yourself that don’t want it to be true. This disease spreads very fast and very easily. If the flu spread like this does and we didn’t have vaccines and known treatment options, we would be in the same situation.
Auto accidents are very survivable, but they vary in severity and are relatively rare. But, if everyone’s chances of being involved in an accident started shooting up and suddenly became the 3rd leading cause of death and we didn’t have a way to prevent them except to stop driving we would have choices to make.
You can't say that yet. It's like projecting the number of yards an NFL quarterback iss going to throw for on the season based on a few preseason games. And that is all we have seen from the coronavirus so far... The preseason. NY and the NE caught a little bit of the real deal in March.
We hope the flu is deadlier with children and young adults. We hope this coronavirus is unlike all others and thrives in the summer and not the winter. But we have not seen Covid19 in fall or winter yet. That's when cold and flu viruses cause virtually all pediatric (and adult for that matter) mortality.
View attachment 17015
The 4 year rolling average for flu is 154. So far, 77 pediatric deaths have been contributed to Covid 19, even though 90 percent of kids have not been in the setting where they typically share and spread viruses. But those are only confirmed deaths and data has been spotty from some states. Nearly all of these deaths occurred between the times you see those big spikes on pediatric cold/flu deaths.
https://www.medpagetoday.com/pediatrics/generalpediatrics/87711
Hopefully not another single pediatric hospitalization or death occurs. Hopefully the social distancing and safety protocols schools are taking continue to protect children.
The better and more accurate statement is "children have fared infinitely better than older adults with Covid19 so far and hopefully it continues." But the last thing we want is for it to be "flu-like" and have have a massive spike in pediatric deaths beginning in late fall.
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There was what seemed to me a pretty good response to the Boston ER doctors article that basically pointed out he and his colleagues wouldn't know of any flu deaths b/c they don't occur in the emergency room. Basically said ask long term care workers, hospice workers, oncologists, pulmonologists, etc. that see flu deaths because most of them are already being treated for poor health. Don't know if that's right, but it seems plausible.
My Father-in-Law in 2018. He had flu and pneumonia shot in fall of 2017. Got sick after Christmas, went to ER on the 29th. Had pneumonia in one lung. Went on respirator to let that lung heal. Was stable for about a week. Then one night pneumonia developed in other lung. He passed about 4 hours later.
A word about sarchoids (Bernie Mack's cause of death) I had it when I was a kid. There were no symptoms and no ill affects for me. A friend for college also had it with no ill effects. Mine was found showing swelling of the lymph nodes in the chest found in a routine chest x-ray. A biopsy was done to rule out Hodgkin's. The way the doctor explained it to me was that it is selective (for lack of a better term) in how it affects people. It is usually lethal if you are a black female. Over 50% lethal if you are a black male. Just under 50 % lethal for a white female. And as was my case and my buddy's usually no symptoms at all if you are white male.
We did make everyone wear seatbelts, and deaths went down considerably. I know at the time there was empirical evidence that seatbelts saved lives as opposed to masks now but, ****, it’s worth a try.
Excellent point. Nobody wants to stop driving, so you create safety laws and speed limits. Unfortunately many people think the guberment wants to take away their constutooshunul riiights and they can damn well speed and do whatever the hell they want.
Usually when people die of the flu, people find other reasons of why they died.
People die of COVID b/c of COVID and they don't look for other reasons.
Part of it is media frenzy and I fall for it as well. There is a clear expectation you recover from the flu. It's not as clear with COVID.
People die of COVID b/c of COVID and they don't look for other reasons.
Part of it is media frenzy and I fall for it as well. There is a clear expectation you recover from the flu. It's not as clear with COVID.
I have known 3 people who have had Covid-19.
All 3 responded differently.
36 year old female- lost sense of smell and had a low grade fever every evening for 17 days.
28 year old male- tested positive. No symptoms other than fatigue.
55 year old male with no comorbidities- full range of symptoms- was in ICU for 5 days, no ventilator- he has recovered with some remaining issues such as fatigue and shortness of breath.
All 3 responded differently.
36 year old female- lost sense of smell and had a low grade fever every evening for 17 days.
28 year old male- tested positive. No symptoms other than fatigue.
55 year old male with no comorbidities- full range of symptoms- was in ICU for 5 days, no ventilator- he has recovered with some remaining issues such as fatigue and shortness of breath.
From what I could tell, CDC lists deaths by Flu/Pneumonia. It seems that in the case of flu and COVID, they are catalysts for producing deadly pneumonia events. The asymptomatic folks, as well as incubation period for COVID seem to be the real doozies with regards to its ability to reach much further into the population than the flu. I'd be curious to see how the % of flu cases that lead to pneumonia compare to COVID. Is it the sheer number of COVID infections that are driving things up, or is it also more likely to cause pneumonia, so the impact is non-linear? Being that we haven't been able to get the most basic accurate data out of this event, I think that it is highly unlikely that we will know such in depth data soon...
The CDC says the actual number of people that have the Covid at this moment is 10 Times the amount that have tested positive... the majority have little to no symptoms and aren’t going for test. We have done more Covid Test in the last 7 days in the US than Flu test the last 3 years combined (most people don’t get tested for Flu unless they are sick).... The virus will run its course (see New York) and even if there was a vaccine announced today it would be 6 Months before we would have enough to vaccinate people.....
I hope you are right and the worst is behind us. But I believe in the duck. If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck... It's probably a duck. The duck here is this is a coronavirus. All other coronaviruses thrive in cooler dryer weather (winter specifically.) All respiratory viruses become much more serious and deadly in the fall and winter when our immune systems are weaker. That's my common sense duck analysis. Quack - quack.
I do agree with you in the testing is catching so many people that are asymptomatic, but not nearly all. My duck on this is that most people are asymptomatic in the summer because of a lower dose of virus and healthier immune response. I don't think all of the other viruses go away every summer, I just think the spread slows down and it's so mild when get them we are either asymptomatic or have such mild symptoms we chalk it up to allergies.
The one area where I don't have a duck is herd immunity. I have seen 20%- 80% as the magic number. The lower the better. If I had to bet it would be somewhere above 50% considering the hardest hit area in the world is Bergamo Italy and they have tested out with 57% antibodies... They're not even sure if they are done yet. So I will defer to the experts...
The same person that says 10 people for every positive have actually gotten it (Dr Redfield, the CDC director) also says, "I do think the fall and the winter of 2020 and 2021 are going to be probably one of the most difficult times we've experienced in American public health."
So that statement alone is reason enough for me to keep my head on a swivel.
You may be tilting the wrong windmill... I was a bit in the bag when I wrote that last night, so I imagine its hard to follow. So I will clear up my thoughts. In my entire life I have not known anyone that died of the flu. I don't personally know anyone that has died of Covid either, but its only been around for a few months. So, I looked at famous people. It looks like 11 celebs I have heard of have died of flu/pneumonia in the last 12 years. 6 from Covid since March...
I babbled about misreporting deaths as flu and would assume its a similar ratio between the two.. Anyone not willing to admit there have been 17 ups with Covid data is hiding from the truth. The net-net is so far it looks like 1 celeb per year I have heard of has died of flu and 1 celeb per month has died of Covid so far... So that's around a 10-1 ratio of celebrity Covid deaths compared to flu. Not a scientific measurement by any means, but I thought it was interesting.
So if you think my drunk *** was in denial by suggesting Covid appears to be 10 times more deadly to celebs... I don't know how to respond. I am guessing my drivel made you think I was downplaying the severity of Covid. I am not.
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