Younguns, Jordan was the GOAT

[Drebin]

Green is a do-it-all type of player, that isn’t a great 3 point shooter. If your definition of a stretch 4 means the player doesn’t have to be 3 good point shooter, then that can be your definition buddy.

And look at the NBA champions before the warriors...Cektics, Lakers, Spurs, Heat. They played the game nothing like the warriors.

So please, educate yourself a little bit. You listed Dirk and KD as your main argument lmao. The warriors started the “3 or dunk” type offense. That’s inarguable. It’s fact. Take the L and move on.

You are incapable of reason. That's a dangerous thing when you're an idiot on top of it.

A stretch four is defined as a power forward who plays out on the perimeter, and not generally on the post. In case you didn't know, basketball players play on both ends of the floor.

When talking championships, aGAIN, you're moving the goalposts. Those teams you refer to, for the most part, had big guys and still ran offense through the post at times.

As far as "three or dunk" offense, it's not something Golden State created. Oklahoma City was running those concepts. The Heat ran those concepts with Bosh, Wade, and James. The difference is that those guy would actually attack the rim instead of standing out behind the three point line and jacking up threes like a bunch of pussies. The concepts are the same, but the types of shots are different.

You literally have no idea what you're talking about, so telling me to educate myself is rich. You've disqualified yourself.

 

[Msubulldogfan1]

You are incapable of reason. That's a dangerous thing when you're an idiot on top of it.

A stretch four is defined as a power forward who plays out on the perimeter, and not generally on the post. In case you didn't know, basketball players play on both ends of the floor.

When talking championships, aGAIN, you're moving the goalposts. Those teams you refer to, for the most part, had big guys and still ran offense through the post at times.

As far as "three or dunk" offense, it's not something Golden State created. Oklahoma City was running those concepts. The Heat ran those concepts with Bosh, Wade, and James. The difference is that those guy would actually attack the rim instead of standing out behind the three point line and jacking up threes like a bunch of pussies. The concepts are the same, but the types of shots are different.

You literally have no idea what you're talking about, so telling me to educate myself is rich. You've disqualified yourself.

The heat and thunder were not shooting 3s dude, holy hell. THATS HOW GS CHANGED THE GAME. You’re a lost cause.

And the fact that you called them pussies because they are all time great 3 point shooters shows how triggered you are.

 

[paindonthurt_]

You are so dumb.

 

[Seinfeld]

Yeah, and James Harden has shot 7,300 in 11 seasons. When you actually drive to the basket, fouls are still called at a very high clip today.

 

[Drebin]

The heat and thunder were not shooting 3s dude, holy hell. THATS HOW GS CHANGED THE GAME. You’re a lost cause.

And the fact that you called them pussies because they are all time great 3 point shooters shows how triggered you are.

You are making yourself look dumber with every post.

 

[Drebin]

Your logic is flawed. The Warriors are a prolific 3 point shooting dynasty. Why would tougher basketball in the paint affect that? Who gives a **** if the Bulls have Will Perdue, Dennis Rodman, Horace Grant and Bill Cartwright beating everyone up in the paint. Sounds like more room for 3 point shooters on the perimeter to me.

Because Ron Harper and Michael Jordan would be out there handchecking the hell out of those guys and they wouldn't be getting off those kinds of shots. To adjust, those guys would have to create off the dribble more, which brings the bigger guys into the mix.

 

[Msubulldogfan1]

You are making yourself look dumber with every post.

Says the pot, apparently. I mean, you actually brought up Dirk when we were talking about golden state lmao. Geez.

 

[Drebin]

Says the pot, apparently. I mean, you actually brought up Dirk when we were talking about golden state lmao. Geez.

Which was relevant before you moved the goalposts for the third time in this thread.

 

[My Bru]

No, the advent of the stretch-four, which really started coming into play with the influx of europeans into the league, changed how basketball is played.

Now this is the sort of thing I can understand. I had to look up what a "stretch-four" was, and I see it's just a big man who can shoot and handle the ball better. Not to mention that guys nowadays seem to be able to hit 3's better.

So, the game has not changed. The players have. That's similar to me to quarterbacks who can now throw and run. They aren't throwing any lesser, they are just running better. And throwing better when thinking of someone like Mahomes.

I don't think there's any sinister puppet master out there trying to change the games. Some rules were put in place in football to make it safer, which freed up quarterbacks to not be QUITE as paranoid as before. I don't really know about the basketball fouls.

 

[Drebin]

So if the 'soft' team had to play in that era, they wouldnt have even gotten out of the 1st round? Thats a tough one to accept, but sure.
If you use those parameters though, then the 'hard' teams from that era would suck hard playing in the current style of basketball. Players move quicker, the ball moves faster, and Detroit(or others) would either foul our or be ejected. Seriously- there would be 1 or more ejections each game due to how they played defense. Every 17ing posession would result in free throws for the Warriors if they didnt already launch and probably make a 3.
Benches would be sparse due to the numbers fouling out each game.


I have no idea why contact, which is a foul, was so ignored back then.

I don't disagree with your theory in general, but there were a lot of mediocre teams back then, too. The argument was made that this GS team was one of the GOATs. Maybe my first round exit assessment was a little extreme. Maybe they would have gotten by the Bullets or the Cavaliers in a round one. But the Celtics? The Lakers? The Bulls? The Pistons?

On one of GS's title runs (2015), they played the Grizzlies in the second round and struggled against them. The reason they did is because the Grizzlies played old school perimeter defense and made Golden State defend the post. The Grizzlies went up 2-1 with Zach Randolph abusing Draymond Green and Tony Allen shutting down Klay Thompson in that series and Golden State was in trouble, until Tony Allen got hurt, which changed everything. That's the point I'm making. The right team can force them out of their style of play.

 

[DAWG61]

If Harden and Jordan are going to the line the same amount of time that should tell people something.

 

[hatfieldms]

Why drive to the basket for 2 points or 2 free throws when Curry is a career 43.5% 3 point shooter? Jordan 32.7%.

I’m just pointing out why jordan shot more free throws

 

[dog12]

Green is a do-it-all type of player, that isn’t a great 3 point shooter. If your definition of a stretch 4 means the player doesn’t have to be 3 good point shooter, then that can be your definition buddy.

And look at the NBA champions before the warriors...Cektics, Lakers, Spurs, Heat. They played the game nothing like the warriors.

So please, educate yourself a little bit. You listed Dirk and KD as your main argument lmao. The warriors started the “3 or dunk” type offense. That’s inarguable. It’s fact. Take the L and move on.

I'd love to watch the Warriors (any of them) try the "dunk" option of their offense with either Bill Laimbeer or Rick Mahorn in the lane on defense.

Man v. boy.

 

[T-TownDawgg]

Yep, or the 80's Celtics with Bird, Ainge, Parrish, DJ and McHale.
Five HOF'ers playing as a unit; IMO best defensive team ever on a basketball court. Pistons took it to another level by beating people up and getting in their heads, not necessarily playing great fundamental defense.

 

[dorndawg]

Curry wouldn't be shooting at that clip in the 80s era. Curry's father Dell was a better shooter than he was, so there's a comp for you to look into if you're actually interested in educating yourself.

You are a volume shooter of being wrong about basketball.

Dell Curry, career:
FG 45.7%
3PT 40.2%
FT 84.3

Steph Curry, career:
FG 47.6%
3PT 43.5%
FT 90.6%

 

[T-TownDawgg]

I think LeBron is the most physically gifted basketball player ever. 1on1 vs MJ would be all-time-must-see ****.
Both put up individually comparable offensive numbers, with James spotting MJ a considerable amount of weight and height.

Jordan did more with less.

 

[Msubulldogfan1]

I don't disagree with your theory in general, but there were a lot of mediocre teams back then, too. The argument was made that this GS team was one of the GOATs. Maybe my first round exit assessment was a little extreme. Maybe they would have gotten by the Bullets or the Cavaliers in a round one. But the Celtics? The Lakers? The Bulls? The Pistons?

On one of GS's title runs (2015), they played the Grizzlies in the second round and struggled against them. The reason they did is because the Grizzlies played old school perimeter defense and made Golden State defend the post. The Grizzlies went up 2-1 with Zach Randolph abusing Draymond Green and Tony Allen shutting down Klay Thompson in that series and Golden State was in trouble, until Tony Allen got hurt, which changed everything. That's the point I'm making. The right team can force them out of their style of play.

The comparison doesn’t only go one way. You bring the Celtics, lakers, whomever from back then to now...those GS teams are stomping them.

 

[dog12]

Another way to say that is if those lakers/bulls/celtics teams had played in the 2010s, they would have got donkey stomped by the warriors.

The only way the Warriors could beat those teams is if the Lakers/Bulls/Celtics were plucked from the 80s-90s and dropped directly into the 2010s at playoff time. The Lakers/Bulls/Celtics would initially struggle with the different style of play and the stricter refereeing.

Conversely, if the Lakers/Bulls/Celtics were dropped into the 2010s at the beginning of a season, then they'd have plenty of time to adjust their defense to the "raining 3s" offense and the stricter refereeing. The Lakers/Bulls/Celtics would win the NBA Championship. No team in the 2010s could beat them in a 7-game series.

(my opinion)

 

[Drebin]

You are a volume shooter of being wrong about basketball.

Dell Curry, career:
FG 45.7%
3PT 40.2%
FT 84.3

Steph Curry, career:
FG 47.6%
3PT 43.5%
FT 90.6%

Dell Curry played in an era where three's weren't taken as often, and when they were, there was usually someone hanging on his arm. And he didn't even have a three point line in college. Dell also did something else that Steph doesn't do: play defense.

Steph himself has said his father was a better shooter than he is.

Your dunk attempt was an airball.

 

[Drebin]

Yep, or the 80's Celtics with Bird, Ainge, Parrish, DJ and McHale.
Five HOF'ers playing as a unit; IMO best defensive team ever on a basketball court. Pistons took it to another level by beating people up and getting in their heads, not necessarily playing great fundamental defense.

I agree...I wouldn't call what Mahorn, Salley, or Laimbeer was doing fundamental defense, but you gotta give the devil his due: Rodman was one of the best defensive players of all time. That's why the Bulls were unbeatable more than anything...they had three high-level defenders on the floor. That's why teams like Golden State don't belong in that conversation.

 

[dorndawg]

Were they hanging off Dell's arms when he shot free throws, too?

 

[dorndawg]

Dell Curry played in an era where three's weren't taken as often, and when they were, there was usually someone hanging on his arm. And he didn't even have a three point line in college. Dell also did something else that Steph doesn't do: play defense.

Steph himself has said his father was a better shooter than he is.

Your dunk attempt was an airball.

Hold the line! Dell Curry shot 4 OF 7 from the 3pt line in 84/85 for Virginia Tech. MAYBE DREBIN IS RIGHT AND DELL CURRY CAN MAKE SHOTS THAT DON'T EVEN EXIST?!?!

 

[Drebin]

Hold the line! Dell Curry shot 4 OF 7 from the 3pt line in 84/85 for Virginia Tech. MAYBE DREBIN IS RIGHT AND DELL CURRY CAN MAKE SHOTS THAT DON'T EVEN EXIST?!?!

The three point line was instituted in college basketball in 1986. In the NBA, it was 1979.

https://www.usab.com/youth/news/2011/06/the-history-of-the-3-pointer.aspx

 

[dorndawg]

That was when the NCAA instituted the rule. Conferences had the line earlier, for instance the ACC tried it out starting in 1983. But I'm sure you already knew that.********************

 

[Drebin]

That was when the NCAA instituted the rule. Conferences had the line earlier, for instance the ACC tried it out starting in 1983. But I'm sure you already knew that.********************

Except Virginia Tech wasn't in the ACC. They were in the Metro. But I thought you already knew that.***************

I will concede it's possible that maybe one year in an NIT or something they experimented with a three point line so he got to play with one a couple of games. But he didn't have the benefit of a three point line for his college career.

 

[dorndawg]

Which is why I didn't say they were. Please try to keep up.

 

[Drebin]

Which is why I didn't say they were. Virginia Tech was in the now-defunct Metro Conference. Please try to keep up.

Everybody here saw what you said. Except it wasn't correct. The Metro did not use the three point line.

 

[dorndawg]

By God I reckon Dell Curry is so good, he gets stats for shots that didn't even exist.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/dell-curry-1.html

 

[T-TownDawgg]

Fellas, fellas. I think we can all agree on this:


Isaiah Thomas is still a 17in piece of ****

 

[Drebin]

By God I reckon Dell Curry is so good, he gets stats for shots that didn't even exist.

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/dell-curry-1.html

You're embarrassing yourself. It's entertaining though...I'll give you that.

 

[Drebin]

Fellas, fellas. I think we can all agree on this:


Isaiah Thomas is still a 17in piece of ****

Yes, this is true.

 

[dorndawg]

Keep shootin', shooter.

 

[dorndawg]

Oh yeah that's 100%.

 

[IBleedMaroonDawg]

If these GS teams had played in in the 80s-90s, they’d probably have never made it to the finals. Last night’s episodes detailed just how tough you had to be to win a championship in that era, and I give the warriors credit for a lot of things, but tough is definitely not a word I’d use to describe them. They’ve benefited as much if not more than anyone from today’s rules

It would not take my Bulls to beat them. Just throw them in a series with the bad boys from Detroit and see what would happen.

Jordan was the GOAT. He made the other players better, no matter who they were. The others are great, great players but when you go back and seriously watch what he did with and without the ball it is still unbelievable. The free throw with his eyes closed while talking **** with an opposing player is still one of my favorite memories when the game was fun to watch.

He never had to tell everyone he was the GOAT either.

I really miss the days when there were so many really good teams and great players to watch as well.

 

[jethreauxdawg]

When Boston won the title in ‘86

Yes, Steph Curry and the warriors actually changed how basketball is played. Nothing more needs to be said about that teams greatness.

They averaged 112.6ppg, 6th best in the league. When GS won in ‘15, they averaged 114.9ppg, 1st in the league. In ‘86, the lakers led the league with 117.3ppg. The best GS team averaged 116.9ppg in ‘18. You can argue they have changed scoring, but it’s really not much different even though so many more 3’s are made now. I used ‘86 because I recently watched the 30 for 30 on that year. Ppg is similar for the next few years after. Someone else can lookup the Jordan years.

 

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

They are great shooters but they also have never been legally hand checked like what was allowed in the 90's.

Their historic loss of a 3-1 lead happened in large part because the Cavs tried to bully ball Curry under the current rules. Imagine how tough of a time they'd have under rules that were much more permissive to physical defense.

 

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

Because it wasn't just tougher in the paint. Read a book you moron. The hand check rules changed perimeter basketball just as much, if not more, than in the paint.

 

[Msubulldogfan1]

You're embarrassing yourself. It's entertaining though...I'll give you that.

It’s interesting how quick you are to insult others, it’s very telling about yourself.

 

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

Jordan is the GOAT, it's not really an argument

The fact that he dominated so thoroughly, WHEN he dominated, as a guard is simply other-worldly.

It's hard to compare eras but there's no doubt that it's easier to score now than it was in the 90's. The hand-check rules changed the game. Jordan dominated as a guard when you were allowed to basically mug people. Imagine how dominant he'd be with the rules the Warriors enjoy.

Plus, if advanced metrics had existed in Jordan's time, does anyone seriously doubt he wouldn't have looked at the data and spent his career becoming a lights out three point shooter? I mean this 6'6" guard completely changed his game via post play just so he could beat the Pistons. The competitive obsession sets him apart. He's the GOAT and that's no slight to LeBron. There's nothing insulting about saying James is the 2nd best player to ever play. His fans should get over themselves.

 

[QuadrupleOption]

Senile old men and their delusions***

Loch Ness Monsters and their Tree Fiddys.