Thought exercise - 2018 football team

[FQDawg]

There are quite a few people who have criticized Moorhead for not changing up his offense to better fit the team we had in 2018 (or even 2019). But let's say we had hired Leach then instead of Moorhead, do you think he would have abandoned the Air Raid to run a more run-oriented spread that better fit that 2018 team or do you think we would have just taken his lumps while trying to install his offense?

 

[UpTheMiddlex3Punt]

I don't think scheme was really the problem. It was discipline. Not just the acting up type of discipline, but the discipline to practice the plays to precision and get into good physical condition. If the scheme were the problem we would have seen a ton of blown assignments and receivers running the wrong routes. Instead it was lots of dropped passes and an O-Line that was gassed by the second quarter.

Leach has taken quarterbacks who have no business passing for more than 3000 yards in a season and getting them to pass for over 4000.

 

[The Situation]

Nope, it would have been the exact same, except we would have had discipline. Moorhead and Leach are both system coaches, that's what they are. People were just so used to Mullen, who was more of a fundamental coach and molded his scheme to his players. Yes, he did have a base offense, but he was by no means an offensive guru. I do think Leach would have been slightly more successful because his system is more simplified.

That's why I say we shouldn't have as big of a learning curve this time around, because we are 2 years into a transition to a passing team.

 

[The Situation]

I don't think scheme was really the problem. It was discipline. Not just the acting up type of discipline, but the discipline to practice the plays to precision and get into good physical condition. If the scheme were the problem we would have seen a ton of blown assignments and receivers running the wrong routes. Instead it was lots of dropped passes and an O-Line that was gassed by the second quarter.

Leach has taken quarterbacks who have no business passing for more than 3000 yards in a season and getting them to pass for over 4000.

It was scheme too. Moorhead's offense works with a talent advantage. NFL type stuff.

 

[T-TownDawgg]

It was scheme too. Moorhead's offense works with a talent advantage. NFL type stuff.

********. Moorhead had a gift-wrapped 2018 offense with some sizeable talent advantages and whatever "scheme" he was attempting squandered it.

 

[Maroon Eagle]

Lumps.

 

[OliveBranchDAWG]

There are quite a few people who have criticized Moorhead for not changing up his offense to better fit the team we had in 2018 (or even 2019). But let's say we had hired Leach then instead of Moorhead, do you think he would have abandoned the Air Raid to run a more run-oriented spread that better fit that 2018 team or do you think we would have just taken his lumps while trying to install his offense?

Leach would’ve ran a version of his offense more adapted to our personnel, that’s what good coaches do. Moorhead tried to get the personnel to adapt to his offense, that’s what poor/inexperienced coaches do.

 

[57stratdawg]

I think Leach gets us to a NY6 game with the 2018 roster. At least.

 

[The Situation]

Leach would’ve ran a version of his offense more adapted to our personnel, that’s what good coaches do. Moorhead tried to get the personnel to adapt to his offense, that’s what poor/inexperienced coaches do.

It's not that black and white. Are Rich Rodriguez, Chip Kelly and Gus Malzahn bad coaches? How about Coach Ken, Paul Johnson? They are system coaches, they know a system.

We hired Moorhead to run his system. Turns out it was a bad decision, because our personnel didn't fit it, and he did not know how to run a program discipline-wise, which has been beaten to death.

 

[Ralph Cramden]

Leach is gonna run the air raid offense regardless of whether we have the proper personnel. Most coaches have their schemes and that's what they run. You hired that coach knowing his system. He isn't going to adapt to his players. Changed has to be forced. Handing off to Kylin for 2 ypc won't win.

 

[OliveBranchDAWG]

It's not that black and white. Are Rich Rodriguez, Chip Kelly and Gus Malzahn bad coaches? How about Coach Ken, Paul Johnson? They are system coaches, they know a system.

We hired Moorhead to run his system. Turns out it was a bad decision, because our personnel didn't fit it, and he did not know how to run a program discipline-wise, which has been beaten to death.

None of those coaches are stubborn/dumb enough to try and run their ideal “system” repeatedly if it doesn’t work. They will run a variation of their system adapting to their personnel. Like Rich Rod last year, he ran the ball 80% of the time at OM towards the end of the season (bc they had good RB’s & Plumlee) he’s historically been more of a run first type offense, but never that heavy.

Rich Rod was 70% run and 30% pass at WVU and 55% run and 45% pass at Arizona. That’s adapting to personnel and fit.

Moorhead should’ve ran the ball around 75% of the time in 2018(see 2018 Auburn game= 77% run & 350 rushing yards). Instead he wanted to drop back Fitz 5 wide and throw way more than he should, just for the sake of balance and trying to fit the players to what he likes to run.

 

[OliveBranchDAWG]

It's not that black and white. Are Rich Rodriguez, Chip Kelly and Gus Malzahn bad coaches? How about Coach Ken, Paul Johnson? They are system coaches, they know a system.

We hired Moorhead to run his system. Turns out it was a bad decision, because our personnel didn't fit it, and he did not know how to run a program discipline-wise, which has been beaten to death.

2018 Kentucky game. Pouring rain. Was a one possession game until less than 8 minutes left in the 4th quarter. Kylin Hill carried the ball 4 times total, and we passed the ball 55% of the time. That is asinine.

That’s just Moorhead’s fault, what an awful gameplan. He was being a stubborn dumbass, and not setting our players up to succeed

Do you think Mullen ideally wanted to run the Relf Coast offense In 2010? Hell no. He did it because of the hand he was dealt, and it worked. That’s what good coaches do.

 

[randystewart]

Part of it was scheme and stupidity. For 2 years defenses showed a look, waited for us to change the play from the sideline, then changed the look again. So more often than not we were running a play meant for a look the defense was no longer in. We never really adjusted to this, even though it was blatantly clear what defenses were doing and what the scouting report was on us. All of Moorhead's BS was built on "taking what the defense gives you" but defenses were smart enough to thwart that pre-snap. We were apparently not smart enough to see that though for 2 full years. In the end, Moorhead's offense worked at a D2 school and with an absolutely stacked Penn State roster. It absolutely did not work here, and I doubt it will work elsewhere unless he significantly adjusts

 

[The Situation]

2018 Kentucky game. Pouring rain. Was a one possession game until less than 8 minutes left in the 4th quarter. Kylin Hill carried the ball 4 times total, and we passed the ball 55% of the time. That is asinine.

That’s just Moorhead’s fault, what an awful gameplan. He was being a stubborn dumbass, and not setting our players up to succeed

Do you think Mullen ideally wanted to run the Relf Coast offense In 2010? Hell no. He did it because of the hand he was dealt, and it worked. That’s what good coaches do.

Mullen is not a system coach. He has a basic idea of what he wants to do, but he doesn't have a rigid system at all.

Contrary to popular opinion, Mullen is very similar to Saban in the way he does things.

 

[OliveBranchDAWG]

Mullen is not a system coach. He has a basic idea of what he wants to do, but he doesn't have a rigid system at all.

Contrary to popular opinion, Mullen is very similar to Saban in the way he does things.

Sure, Mullen is flexible within his offensive system, depending on what he has to work with. If you think about it, Mullen didn’t run the type of offense he probably ideally wanted until 2014. He showed he could do more with less offensively from 2009-2013 (2009 Tyson Lee, 2010-2011 Relf, 2012-13 immobile Tyler Russell)

Moorhead was dealt a good hand on offense in 2018, a team built to pound the ball with a good o line, and he completely **** the bed. If he wasn’t so stubborn, he would’ve won a couple more games in 2018 and he’d probably still be our coach (unfortunately).

 

[The Situation]

Sure, Mullen is flexible within his offensive system, depending on what he has to work with. If you think about it, Mullen didn’t run the type of offense he probably ideally wanted until 2014. He showed he could do more with less offensively from 2009-2013 (2009 Tyson Lee, 2010-2011 Relf, 2012-13 immobile Tyler Russell)

Moorhead was dealt a good hand on offense in 2018, a team built to pound the ball with a good o line, and he completely **** the bed. If he wasn’t so stubborn, he would’ve won a couple more games in 2018 and he’d probably still be our coach (unfortunately).

We certainly agree on what should have happened in 2018. I just tend to put that more on Cohen than Moorhead. I have no doubts Moorhead did the best he could, with the ability he had, and he certainly left the personnel in pretty good shape (with the exception of some bad redshirting issues). Coaching isn't easy, and handling 100 college boys who are also great athletes, is difficult.

Cohen corrected the issue before it got out of hand, and for that he is to be applauded, but we are now back to Ground Zero. Leach better work out or his seat will be very hot.

 

[Bcash2]

Gardner Minshew would have come to play for the home team and we would have rolled.

 

[The Situation]

Gardner Minshew would have come to play for the home team and we would have rolled.

You know....that is the wild card we have not discussed.

I often wondered what would have happened had Moorhead brought him in, and moved Fitzgerald to wide receiver. But with Leach it would have been even better.

 

[FQDawg]

2018 Kentucky game. Pouring rain. Was a one possession game until less than 8 minutes left in the 4th quarter. Kylin Hill carried the ball 4 times total, and we passed the ball 55% of the time. That is asinine.

If you think passing the ball 55% of the time is bad, I've got some news you probably aren't going to like. As Texas Tech and Washington State, Leach averaged throwing the ball about 71% of the time and his lowest pass percentage in a given year (by my rough calculations) seems to be 65% during the 2016 season at Washington State.

 

[OliveBranchDAWG]

If you think passing the ball 55% of the time is bad, I've got some news you probably aren't going to like. As Texas Tech and Washington State, Leach averaged throwing the ball about 71% of the time and his lowest pass percentage in a given year (by my rough calculations) seems to be 65% during the 2016 season at Washington State.

That’s wonderful but I think you missed my point.

I don’t care if we pass the ball 90% of the time or 10% of the time if it’s successful. This is about 2018, the players we had, and the type of offense Moorhead was trying to run with those players was counterproductive. He didn’t adapt.

 

[FQDawg]

That’s wonderful but I think you missed my point.

I don’t care if we pass the ball 90% of the time or 10% of the time if it’s successful. This is about 2018, the players we had, and the type of offense Moorhead was trying to run with those players was counterproductive. He didn’t adapt.

I agree completely. Moorhead didn't adapt. But I don't think Leach necessarily would have "adapted" in that situation either. If anything, we might have been even more pass heavy in 2018 if he'd been here then.

 

[thekimmer]

I don't think scheme was really the problem. It was discipline. Not just the acting up type of discipline, but the discipline to practice the plays to precision and get into good physical condition. If the scheme were the problem we would have seen a ton of blown assignments and receivers running the wrong routes. Instead it was lots of dropped passes and an O-Line that was gassed by the second quarter.

Leach has taken quarterbacks who have no business passing for more than 3000 yards in a season and getting them to pass for over 4000.

I think it might have been some of both but as time passed the more I think lack of discipline and preparation might have been the biggest culprit. In addition to the things you mentioned we also saw a lot of laziness/disorganization related penalties, poor fundamentals, and a tendency to play worse with more prep time.

 

[Fab5Coug]

Leach would’ve ran a version of his offense more adapted to our personnel, that’s what good coaches do. Moorhead tried to get the personnel to adapt to his offense, that’s what poor/inexperienced coaches do.

You might be surprised. Leach is crazy stubborn that way. He will run his version of the Air Raid regardless of your personal or game situation.

Case in point, UW completely owned him in the Apple Cup. Rush 3, drop 8, every game. Leach outright refused to run the ball with any consistency to try to make them adjust. 2018's Apple Cup, there was a blizzard in the second half and WSU just kept throwing, throwing, throwing.

The thing with Leach is, he truly believes the only thing that can stop his offense is his own teams lack of execution. There is nothing a defense will do that will lead him to change it, because he thinks his team just has to execute better to beat whatever the other team is doing.

 

[Ralph Cramden]

Leach is not going to run the ball more than 30% of the time. Period. We are gonna have to be patient until he makes it work. Leach is gonna Leach. Air Raid or bust. We are all in now boys.

 

[Misfit]

Can you find any evidence that Leach has ever done that? Leach runs the air raid, nothing else.