Thunder & Lightning: Breaking Down Mississippi State’s 2020 Commitment List

[HD6]

In just over 40 days, the early signing period will be here and the first signees of Mississippi State’s recruiting class will send their faxes in to make their pledges complete. How do the Bulldogs stand at this point in the process? Brian Hadad and Joel Coleman take a look at the 2020 commitments.

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[tcdog70]

what has made MSU a top half of SEC team--is JUCO signings. I hear you about 4 star bust out of High School. But , I think we need to sign even more JUCOs. Lately--JUCO's have been our shining stars.

 

[Avelso]

Not just lately but go back and look at the names from the 90's.....this is off the top of my head. I know there are a lot more. Most of these guys were in the NFL for a couple of years.

JJ Johnson
Randy Thomas
Smoot
Ashley Cooper
Toby Galloday
Dorrset Davis
Kevin Prentiss
Edward Smith
Willie Blade

 

[The Situation]

what has made MSU a top half of SEC team--is JUCO signings. I hear you about 4 star bust out of High School. But , I think we need to sign even more JUCOs. Lately--JUCO's have been our shining stars.

Yep. Nobody wants to hear it, but it's 100% truth. It's one of the few advantages we have.

Imagine Mullen's tenure without these guys:

2009: Pernell McPhee, Chris White, Heath Hutchins, Sean Brauchle, Leon Berry, Mo Langston
2010: Vick Ballard, James Carmon
2011: Darius Slay, Dewayne Cherrington
2012: Denico Autry, Charles Siddoway
2013: Justin Cox
2014: Will Coleman, Darrion Hutcherson
2015: Donald Gray, Martinas Rankin, Traver Jung, Jonathan Calvin
2016: Lashard Durr,
2017: Too many to name

Now obviously we need to not go too low or too high here. 2017 was too many, and if Mullen had not tanked the high school recruiting, we wouldn't have needed to do that.

A consistent 5-7 is about right.

 

[The Situation]

Not just lately but go back and look at the names from the 90's.....this is off the top of my head. I know there are a lot more. Most of these guys were in the NFL for a couple of years.

JJ Johnson
Randy Thomas
Smoot
Ashley Cooper
Toby Galloday
Dorrset Davis
Kevin Prentiss
Edward Smith
Willie Blade

Let's also not forget that the one player who could have gotten us a national championship in my lifetime, Scam himself, was also a JUCO.

It's even critical in baseball and basketball. If I'm the new softball coach, I'm probably looking there too.

 

[tcdog70]

see, I don't think 5-7 is enough.. the Podcast made my point--all these 4 stars and dandy dozen high schoolers are a high % bust. Why not sign JUCO's even if you have to red-shirt them. When the JUCOs start being bust then re-evaluate. A Juco that comes in and is a good back-up is not a bust. Depth is important.

side-note--one way K-State became competitive under Snyder was 10-12 Jucos every year.

 

[The Situation]

see, I don't think 5-7 is enough.. the Podcast made my point--all these 4 stars and dandy dozen high schoolers are a high % bust. Why not sign JUCO's even if you have to red-shirt them. When the JUCOs start being bust then re-evaluate. A Juco that comes in and is a good back-up is not a bust. Depth is important.

side-note--one way K-State became competitive under Snyder was 10-12 Jucos every year.

I don't think he signed that many. Remember, that's added effort because you only get them 2 years. The trade off is that you have a big system of them right there in Mississippi. I honestly would probably never venture outside of the state for JUCOs.

 

[tcdog70]

I don't think he signed that many. Remember, that's added effort because you only get them 2 years. The trade off is that you have a big system of them right there in Mississippi. I honestly would probably never venture outside of the state for JUCOs.

So your saying you wouldn't take Cam Newton. Blinn JUCO. We have had good luck with Blinn. You can get 3 years out of some Jucos and you can Red shirt them. And Yes K-State has signed lots of JUCOs.

 

[Cooterpoot]

There’s not that much Juco talent available. You grab up the P5 transfers and placed kids that work out and it’s thin behind that.

 

[57stratdawg]

Correct. JUCO talent is no where near what it used to be.

 

[Rupert Jenkins]

As always you can not predetermined how many you take each year. If there are some really good juco kids you can get it would be stupid not to snag them. Some years there are more than others. You only want them if they are worth it. Same as in state recruiting. Some years we don't have much talent in this state. Last year was a very good year. I don't care where he gets them, just get the best we can attract.

 

[philduckworth]

Easily 5 good Juco's available every year in MS that we HAVE to take at MSU.

 

[IBleedMaroonDawg]

How many are expected to sign in December? Mostly JUCO?

 

[The Situation]

So your saying you wouldn't take Cam Newton. Blinn JUCO. We have had good luck with Blinn. You can get 3 years out of some Jucos and you can Red shirt them. And Yes K-State has signed lots of JUCOs.

That's not what I meant. Of course there are exception. As far as K-State, I know they signed lots of them. But they didn't sign 13 of them per year.

 

[The Situation]

Easily 5 good Juco's available every year in MS that we HAVE to take at MSU.

Agree.

 

[tcdog70]

Correct. JUCO talent is no where near what it used to be.

based on what? your opinion? i think it is higher because of "placed" players.

 

[tcdog70]

That's not what I meant. Of course there are exception. As far as K-State, I know they signed lots of them. But they didn't sign 13 of them per year.

K-State has 20 JuCO's on their team now.

 

[The Situation]

K-State has 20 JuCO's on their team now.

13 * 4 = 52

What are you even arguing? Hell, I agreed with you at first.

 

[Cooterpoot]

based on what? your opinion? i think it is higher because of "placed" players.

Well, you’re wrong. There are fewer placed players. Kids are qualifying more often and schools are more involved in helping them get qualified. Plus, with the new rules, you can’t over sign like in the past. The talent level in MS Juco doesn’t approach the 90s. Especially not HS enrolled kids. The portal is going to start killing some of those P5 transfers too.

 

[57stratdawg]

So many more kids are getting qualified today. We identify talent much younger, it gives them additional time to get their grades in order.

That’s not even getting into the various “plans” that are used these days.

 

[oxfordrebel22]

Yep. Nobody wants to hear it, but it's 100% truth. It's one of the few advantages we have.

Imagine Mullen's tenure without these guys:

2009: Pernell McPhee, Chris White, Heath Hutchins, Sean Brauchle, Leon Berry, Mo Langston
2010: Vick Ballard, James Carmon
2011: Darius Slay, Dewayne Cherrington
2012: Denico Autry, Charles Siddoway
2013: Justin Cox
2014: Will Coleman, Darrion Hutcherson
2015: Donald Gray, Martinas Rankin, Traver Jung, Jonathan Calvin
2016: Lashard Durr,
2017: Too many to name

Now obviously we need to not go too low or too high here. 2017 was too many, and if Mullen had not tanked the high school recruiting, we wouldn't have needed to do that.

A consistent 5-7 is about right.

Wow. That's a really impressive list. Mullen and staff definitely evaluated the JUCO market very effectively.

Ole Miss has seemingly been boom or bust when recruiting JUCO's. I guess that's kind of the case for every school, though. I know 2 of our best 3 defensive players this year were JUCO signees (Lakia Henry and Sam Williams). The MS JUCO system is probably not given enough credit for helping both schools to remain somewhat competitive with competition that has every other advantage in the world.

 

[The Situation]

Well, you’re wrong. There are fewer placed players. Kids are qualifying more often and schools are more involved in helping them get qualified. Plus, with the new rules, you can’t over sign like in the past. The talent level in MS Juco doesn’t approach the 90s. Especially not HS enrolled kids. The portal is going to start killing some of those P5 transfers too.

There are still plenty of players to be had in the MS JUCO system. At least 10 per year. I personally think we should sign Ladamian Webb again.

 

[johnson86-1]

There are still plenty of players to be had in the MS JUCO system. At least 10 per year. I personally think we should sign Ladamian Webb again.

Ten per year seems excessive. Not saying there isn't ever a class that justifies taking 10, but if you take ten consistently, you will usually be redshirting a lot of them. You could end up with 30 of your scholarship spots taken up just by JUCO JRs, RSJrs, Srs, and RSrs. That doesn't seem doable.

 

[tcdog70]

13 * 4 = 52

What are you even arguing? Hell, I agreed with you at first.

I'm not arguing -I'm just pointing out how many they really have FYI.

 

[The Situation]

I'm not arguing -I'm just pointing out how many they really have FYI.

Your information is wrong. You said they sign 10-12 per year and that's asinine.

 

[The Situation]

Ten per year seems excessive. Not saying there isn't ever a class that justifies taking 10, but if you take ten consistently, you will usually be redshirting a lot of them. You could end up with 30 of your scholarship spots taken up just by JUCO JRs, RSJrs, Srs, and RSrs. That doesn't seem doable.

No, I didn't mean that we should sign 10. I'm saying the state system produces at least 10 pretty good players per year, maybe more.

I advocate for 5-7 max.