Tubby or Cal?

Who did it worse?


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saxonburgcat

All-Conference
Aug 22, 2012
4,437
4,151
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Are those numbers accurate?

Nope! They are misleading. In 18 and 19, Cal won 5 NCAA games. He didn't win any games in 20, 21, and 22. 21 the tournament was CANCELLED! Counting the 21 tournament as not winning any games is misleading and maybe even dishonest. Why not compare apples and apples and count the 17 season? That would add 3 to Cal's total.
 
Feb 1, 2004
1,563
263
0
I was around for both.

I am not a Cal guy at all... but no way is it as bad as with Tubby. Tubby was really bad at the end. We ain't there yet. I hope we Never got there - but it's not that bad... yet.

Having said that - I would be ecstatic to see him head to NBA today.
 
Nov 15, 2008
38,645
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Didn’t Rupp go his last 12-13 years without a title. Joe B in 84 with the second half meltdown. Both would have been slaughtered on here.
Cal is already at 10 years without one...Rupp also went to 3 Elite 8's, 2 S-16's and won the SEC every year in his last 5 years as coach.

Comparing Cal to Rupp is like comparing **** to chili...but then again what else would I expect from a professor in revisionist history.
 

saxonburgcat

All-Conference
Aug 22, 2012
4,437
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Cal is already at 10 years without one...Rupp also went to 3 Elite 8's, 2 S-16's and won the SEC every year in his last 5 years as coach.

Comparing Cal to Rupp is like comparing **** to chili...but then again what else would I expect from a professor in revisionist history.
Serious question: Why did you include the year the NCAA had no tournament in your numbers for Cal? That distorts the reality of Cal's record.
 
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Gromcat_rivals

Heisman
Jun 28, 2021
10,292
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I’d take tubby. Even though it was about to probably get worse under him, tubby cared enough to it leave when he needed to and didnt put anything above trying to win at least. Cal’s time was more successful because he managed to get one game further a few times. That’s pretty much it.

Never thought I’d say it but Calipari might be below tubby in my book just because of how he’s created mass apathy with UK basketball. Just listen to some of these Caliphiles and their weak *** excuses.

Pitino’s era was better than Calipari’s by MILES. Not a close call at all.
 

bigsmoothie

All-American
Sep 7, 2004
11,161
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If a "cause" is so great and important then how come they haven't used their NIL to promote said cause?
I'll tell u why, because it has a direct impact on their financial well-being. Guess it wasn't that important.
How do you know they haven’t?
 

bigsmoothie

All-American
Sep 7, 2004
11,161
8,851
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Cal is already at 10 years without one...Rupp also went to 3 Elite 8's, 2 S-16's and won the SEC every year in his last 5 years as coach.

Comparing Cal to Rupp is like comparing **** to chili...but then again what else would I expect from a professor in revisionist history.
How many team made the tourney then? Not 64. Much easier to advance.
 

yoshukai

Heisman
Dec 21, 2002
30,466
43,538
102
Both won a title and represented the school with 100% class. Great successs in the SEC regular season and tourney. Tubby 100% deserved his jersey being retired and Cal will too some day. UK was and is lucky to have both.
Tubby realized it was time to go . Hopefully Cal will too , when the time comes.
 
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wldctky_rivals70430

All-Conference
Jan 20, 2002
7,844
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I am guessing some of you long for the days of having Tubby and a roster full of projects?...Jared Carter, Lukasz Obrzut, Shagari Alleyne, Sheray Thomas, and Bobby Perry on the same roster... no thank you
 

Son_Of_Saul

Hall of Famer
Dec 7, 2007
45,984
102,284
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Both won a title and represented the school with 100% class. Great successs in the SEC regular season and tourney. Tubby 100% deserved his jersey being retired and Cal will too some day. UK was and is lucky to have both.
"Lucky to have both?"

This is Kentucky. Winning is what we do.
 
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saxonburgcat

All-Conference
Aug 22, 2012
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You know why they include it. Same reason they count the last 5 years. It fits their agenda.

I can understand if some of these posters simply make a mistake but when the error is pointed out, they ignore it. This tells me that they have to make crap up to make Cal look bad.
 
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saxonburgcat

All-Conference
Aug 22, 2012
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Oh boy, Cal's record is famous for asterisks though isn't it...always an excuse...without looking, I bet he holds the record over Eddie for wins vacated as a head coach.

Winning percentage, you know actual games won and lost? He comes in behind everyone but Clyde and Sutton...I guess you're going to want to blame Covid for that one too?

I can also remember failure before as in Bobby Morris in the NIT, two fragile PG's and being outcoached by Kevin Ollie among others...where is he at now again?

For once we agree. There is no excuse for Cal not having won some tournament games in year in which there was no tournament. Tubby would have managed to win 6. We need to bring Tubby back so we can win games in the tournament!!
 

saxonburgcat

All-Conference
Aug 22, 2012
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Who in their right mind would go all the way to Alaska to scout Ramon Harris? Man could have frequented the local YMCAs and found more talent.
That was so classic. I still remember Tubby playing Harris in a game and then saying on TV that he was thinking about doing a redshirt year for him. WTH??? Didn't Tubby know the rules?? Apparently not.
 

saxonburgcat

All-Conference
Aug 22, 2012
4,437
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That about it?

Well in your sheltered world, at least I've got Cal to keep me company... [laughing]

Well, I have always given you credit for your "creative art." That is one thing you are good at but statistics definitely isn't something you understand.
 
Nov 15, 2008
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Well, I have always given you credit for your "creative art." That is one thing you are good at but statistics definitely isn't something you understand.
Yeah I'm having a hard time remembering how many NCAA tourney wins we've had the last three years...or the last two if that fits better...seems like it was a whole number in both cases... 🤔
 
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notFromhere

Heisman
Sep 7, 2016
22,813
67,796
113
.... Well, the landscape changed and we no longer had many studs or stability on the roster and his lack of coaching IQ is now on display.

Cal sucking doesn't change that Tubby sucked at the end too. It was just for different reasons. Good guy but it was time to go and it's time for Cal to bounce too but he's going to have to be the one to break up because we can't do it.

What many people fear and then hypothesize is you're going to get some extreme. Somehow you can't get an in-between---smart coach who can also recruit and build a good and consist roster without every year having massive turnover.

Yep. This right here

I will say, after many conversations about this over the years, that the overall reason is the same. Both thought more of their abilities as coach than they have proven to be. Both refused to be (or were simple incapable of being) flexible. They wanted to coach the way they coach regardless of outcome because they'd already proved themselves by winning a title. It's ego in Both cases. It's laziness in both cases.

My nightmare scenario would be choosing between either at this point.

If Tubby used his gift of being able to strategize, and Cal used his marketing ability, and we found a really great developer of talent like neither of those two are or had, we'd be unstoppable with all three on the staff. Lol
 

notFromhere

Heisman
Sep 7, 2016
22,813
67,796
113
Tubby if he was at KY today with the transfers portal and NIL, the guy would coach up whatever he got to a title

Or would he just not return phone calls and stop communicating with recruits he knew were interested?

I seem to recall Coach Smith saying he wasn't a big fan of the transfer portal, so maybe he wouldn't accept transfers like that. Of course, I also recall him saying we'd "run more" as well, so maybe I can't take him at his word on that either.
 
Jan 10, 2015
19,389
33,204
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Makes you wonder why BCG didn’t get a lifetime contract too
Thank goodness Mitch didn’t get his contract on paper and it was only on a napkin. If that would’ve been the case he would’ve probably had some stupid ridiculous contract that we would’ve been stuck with for a few more years! Didn’t UK still have to pay him about 4 million to still go away with his contract only being on a napkin?
 

OmahaCats

All-Conference
Apr 10, 2020
2,209
2,740
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I don't dislike Cal (I think it's time he moved on, though), but I respect Tubby almost as much as Joe B., which is saying something.
I think he bounced back real well honestly from the Covid season. Our guards flopped late in the season. Yes it was a bad loss. But we had a hell of a team for most of the year. I mean a two seed doesn’t suck. I don’t see anyone giving Cal credit for that
 

Nightwish84

All-American
Dec 11, 2020
4,970
6,267
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Give Tubby Cal's roster during his tenure and I guarantee he comes back with more than 1 title.

Tubby got fat and lazy and mailed it in when he got his big payday - sound familiar? The difference is Tubby could coach a team up in a game and make adjustments, whereas Cal is too ignorant and stubborn and gets outcoached on the big stage by far lesser names.
Tubby had better in-game coaching/adjustments. The 98 Duke game was a masterclass. Having said that, in the above, you guarantee Tubby would have more titles with Cal guys, then back up the statement by comparing Tubby to Cal re: mailing it in. That's called trying to have it both ways. Tubby got us #7 and couldn't make it past the EE again, then faded away. Who knows if he would have more with Cal guys. Recently, Pitino has had more success with lower stars and transfers. Give him Cal guys, and the locker room might implode for all we know.

I don't see Cal magically turning this ship around, but I do enjoy the shifts we see on rafters. It wasn't that long ago when some were arguing that Tubby didn't belong in the rafters of Rupp. Why? I can't tell you. There was a weird "he doesn't deserve it" vibe for whatever reason, until it was finally announced. Should be noted as well that the SEC was trash back then and one tournament was completely cancelled. Not taking up for Cal, but his numbers might be slightly improved if the tourney happened and he was coaching during the "oh the SEC? You mean UK and a bunch of nobodies?" timeframe.
 
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Nightwish84

All-American
Dec 11, 2020
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Prefer Tubby every day of the week and twice on Sundays!
Which version of Tubby would you like, because after he left UK, he was shall we say, less than impressive. Love the guy and he deserves praise, but if you want High Point Tubby twice on Sundays, you're going 0-2 by nightfall.
 

Fat-so

All-Conference
Sep 22, 2019
1,462
1,777
0
That awkward time when the Cal cheerleaders aren't pimping "the numbers"...they probably haven't even looked at the numbers and are still reliving the 2012 season...wishing in one hand, while crapping in the other...

Hellfire.. I won’t never daydream about them Lake Cumberland parties & orgies by UK cheerleaders without thinking of this now. Thanks for putting that to rest for me.., 😂.
 

Bluefaithful

All-American
Mar 30, 2009
5,081
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Yeah I'm having a hard time remembering how many NCAA tourney wins we've had the last three years...or the last two if that fits better...seems like it was a whole number in both cases... 🤔
I believe it's the same amount as how many intelligent posts you have made. ZERO
 

bigc45157

All-Conference
Nov 12, 2004
7,027
2,279
0
It's not even a question. Tubby's issue was recruiting and his motivation to do it well. Beyond that, he gave 100% to coaching, winning games, the tournament, respecting our traditions, respecting our fans, etc.

We had a Final Four drought for sure, but people forget that he had about a 3 year span there where we were the winningest program in college ball even though we didn't make it to the FF. And he wasn't ducking the other traditional powers, canceling home and home series, etc.

I'd take that Tubby back in a heartbeat at this point.
Well said, but I’m pretty sure you wouldn’t take Tubby back. The board would eat him alive after a mediocre at best roster and season.
 
Nov 15, 2008
38,645
57,515
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Tubby had better in-game coaching/adjustments. The 98 Duke game was a masterclass. Having said that, in the above, you guarantee Tubby would have more titles with Cal guys, then back up the statement by comparing Tubby to Cal re: mailing it in. That's called trying to have it both ways. Tubby got us #7 and couldn't make it past the EE again, then faded away. Who knows if he would have more with Cal guys. Recently, Pitino has had more success with lower stars and transfers. Give him Cal guys, and the locker room might implode for all we know.

I don't see Cal magically turning this ship around, but I do enjoy the shifts we see on rafters. It wasn't that long ago when some were arguing that Tubby didn't belong in the rafters of Rupp. Why? I can't tell you. There was a weird "he doesn't deserve it" vibe for whatever reason, until it was finally announced. Should be noted as well that the SEC was trash back then and one tournament was completely cancelled. Not taking up for Cal, but his numbers might be slightly improved if the tourney happened and he was coaching during the "oh the SEC? You mean UK and a bunch of nobodies?" timeframe.
So in what areas of coaching (minus recruiting) do you see Cal superior?
 
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Cooger32

Redshirt
May 6, 2021
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We have the biggest babies in a fan base, there’s no team that clings more to championships won in the 40’s and 50’s then Kentucky.
 
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