Calipari NBA angle has backfired

[STL_Cat]

Hear me out -

This kind of stuff has been talked about here pretty much as nauseam, but not sure this angle has been considered as much.

To me, where Calipari killed the competition from a recruiting standpoint 5-10 years ago was he was selling a unique product. Cal crushed the recruiting trail because he sold playing for him, he sold playing his style, he sold his brand of basketball. We can argue about whether or not the “dribble drive” was just a marketing gimmick, but nonetheless it was a gimmick unique to Cal and his style and he sold it that way. And the recruits bought it. Dudes wanted to play for Cal.

Then he went all in on this “I’m helping solve generational poverty and I’m the program to get you to the NBA” angle. It suddenly became all about the NBA. Which I do understand the strategy, these high profile guys are looking at the NBA, I’ll sell them the NBA. Easy Peasy. The players first, I’m going to help you achieve your dreams pitch. UK players pictures in their NBA jerseys all over the facility.

This strategy has a fatal flaw, though. It made Calipari much easier to recruit against. Once you see a few guys out there killing it regardless of where they went to college, how much easier is it for rival recruiters to say “why do you need Calipari to get you to the NBA? You don’t. You can go anywhere and get the exposure you need these days, if you’re good enough.”

As opposed to, “I want to play for Coach Cal because he’s a great coach and he plays a great style that will highlight my abilities and set me up for success.” It’s much more difficult to sell against a product that has unique features and benefits. When all of a sudden the sales pitch is into “I’ll get you to the NBA,” it’s easier for rivals to mitigate that pitch.

just an early Sunday morning thought. I’ll take my slings and arrows now

 

[willyclyde]

The system is broken. Time to change or gtfo.

 

[Blue Wildcat]

We are a long way from the “it” program we once were. Other than being a long term fan of the program, I can’t think of a reason a recruit would come to UK. Style, system, and the program no longer translates to the NBA.

 

[DudahUK]

Hear me out -

This kind of stuff has been talked about here pretty much as nauseam, but not sure this angle has been considered as much.

To me, where Calipari killed the competition from a recruiting standpoint 5-10 years ago was he was selling a unique product. Cal crushed the recruiting trail because he sold playing for him, he sold playing his style, he sold his brand of basketball. We can argue about whether or not the “dribble drive” was just a marketing gimmick, but nonetheless it was a gimmick unique to Cal and his style and he sold it that way. And the recruits bought it. Dudes wanted to play for Cal.

Then he went all in on this “I’m helping solve generational poverty and I’m the program to get you to the NBA” angle. It suddenly became all about the NBA. Which I do understand the strategy, these high profile guys are looking at the NBA, I’ll sell them the NBA. Easy Peasy. The players first, I’m going to help you achieve your dreams pitch. UK players pictures in their NBA jerseys all over the facility.

This strategy has a fatal flaw, though. It made Calipari much easier to recruit against. Once you see a few guys out there killing it regardless of where they went to college, how much easier is it for rival recruiters to say “why do you need Calipari to get you to the NBA? You don’t. You can go anywhere and get the exposure you need these days, if you’re good enough.”

As opposed to, “I want to play for Coach Cal because he’s a great coach and he plays a great style that will highlight my abilities and set me up for success.” It’s much more difficult to sell against a product that has unique features and benefits. When all of a sudden the sales pitch is into “I’ll get you to the NBA,” it’s easier for rivals to mitigate that pitch.

just an early Sunday morning thought. I’ll take my slings and arrows now

Nothing wrong with what you said, IMO.

Cal created a monster and the monster got too big and ate him.

edit: @IL Wildcat I talked to jdrum about my account and nothing. It won’t let me post but a few times a day?

 

[Kampus Korner_rivals164031]

Hear me out -

This kind of stuff has been talked about here pretty much as nauseam, but not sure this angle has been considered as much.

To me, where Calipari killed the competition from a recruiting standpoint 5-10 years ago was he was selling a unique product. Cal crushed the recruiting trail because he sold playing for him, he sold playing his style, he sold his brand of basketball. We can argue about whether or not the “dribble drive” was just a marketing gimmick, but nonetheless it was a gimmick unique to Cal and his style and he sold it that way. And the recruits bought it. Dudes wanted to play for Cal.

Then he went all in on this “I’m helping solve generational poverty and I’m the program to get you to the NBA” angle. It suddenly became all about the NBA. Which I do understand the strategy, these high profile guys are looking at the NBA, I’ll sell them the NBA. Easy Peasy. The players first, I’m going to help you achieve your dreams pitch. UK players pictures in their NBA jerseys all over the facility.

This strategy has a fatal flaw, though. It made Calipari much easier to recruit against. Once you see a few guys out there killing it regardless of where they went to college, how much easier is it for rival recruiters to say “why do you need Calipari to get you to the NBA? You don’t. You can go anywhere and get the exposure you need these days, if you’re good enough.”

As opposed to, “I want to play for Coach Cal because he’s a great coach and he plays a great style that will highlight my abilities and set me up for success.” It’s much more difficult to sell against a product that has unique features and benefits. When all of a sudden the sales pitch is into “I’ll get you to the NBA,” it’s easier for rivals to mitigate that pitch.

just an early Sunday morning thought. I’ll take my slings and arrows now

“This kind of stuff has been talked about here pretty much as nauseam.”

You should have stopped with this opening sentence.

 

[C5matt_rivals373900]

Hear me out -

This kind of stuff has been talked about here pretty much as nauseam, but not sure this angle has been considered as much.

To me, where Calipari killed the competition from a recruiting standpoint 5-10 years ago was he was selling a unique product. Cal crushed the recruiting trail because he sold playing for him, he sold playing his style, he sold his brand of basketball. We can argue about whether or not the “dribble drive” was just a marketing gimmick, but nonetheless it was a gimmick unique to Cal and his style and he sold it that way. And the recruits bought it. Dudes wanted to play for Cal.

Then he went all in on this “I’m helping solve generational poverty and I’m the program to get you to the NBA” angle. It suddenly became all about the NBA. Which I do understand the strategy, these high profile guys are looking at the NBA, I’ll sell them the NBA. Easy Peasy. The players first, I’m going to help you achieve your dreams pitch. UK players pictures in their NBA jerseys all over the facility.

This strategy has a fatal flaw, though. It made Calipari much easier to recruit against. Once you see a few guys out there killing it regardless of where they went to college, how much easier is it for rival recruiters to say “why do you need Calipari to get you to the NBA? You don’t. You can go anywhere and get the exposure you need these days, if you’re good enough.”

As opposed to, “I want to play for Coach Cal because he’s a great coach and he plays a great style that will highlight my abilities and set me up for success.” It’s much more difficult to sell against a product that has unique features and benefits. When all of a sudden the sales pitch is into “I’ll get you to the NBA,” it’s easier for rivals to mitigate that pitch.

just an early Sunday morning thought. I’ll take my slings and arrows now

Can’t argue too much and the biggest mistake was in taking this “one-way” approach he talked about UK being the “gold standard” trying to capitalize on the past wins and great tradition — and lost sight of the MISSION and didn’t embrace a dual philosophy of wins and championships matter along with the people contributing to them!

This reminds me vividly of my 29 years I spent in the Army and particularly in latter stages as was involved in preparing for DS/DS and overseas missions. While being intimately involved in leader briefings there were always discussions by senior leaders/General Officers about what’s right philosophy fir a fighting unit—is it “Mission First, People Follow“ or “People First, Mission Success”!? Well the predominant thinking and opinion was the former, not the latter but I always thought this is just wordplay as IMO you have to prioritize on both though one may provide the guidance and focus for true success! So maybe Cal’s gotten it wrong, huh!?

IMO Cal’s got this off season to “correct the course and the ship” and have a strong comeback and winning season or he gone!!

 

[STL_Cat]

I just watched a 4:30 clip of his introductory press conference. If anyone is wondering what I’m talking about ... watch it.

It’s all about 1 seeds, #1 rankings, NCAA championships, and playing style. Of course he talks about getting great players to do it. But it’s all based on how the system is built, and if “you can play you’ll be in heaven here ...”. I didn’t hear him selling that NBA bill of goods back then. And not coincidentally, he was so much harder to compete against as a result. Just another observation ...

 

[STL_Cat]

“This kind of stuff has been talked about here pretty much as nauseam.”

You should have stopped with this opening sentence.

You could have read the rest of my post and actually commented on the content ... but, you chose not to. Why?

 

[Catlogic15]

I agree with you in that Calipari has put himself in a box, and doesn’t really know how to switch directions to make it fresh again.

 

[Blue Wildcat]

I just watched a 4:30 clip of his introductory press conference. If anyone is wondering what I’m talking about ... watch it.

It’s all about 1 seeds, #1 rankings, NCAA championships, and playing style. Of course he talks about getting great players to do it. But it’s all based on how the system is built, and if “you can play you’ll be in heaven here ...”. I didn’t hear him selling that NBA bill of goods back then. And not coincidentally, he was so much harder to compete against as a result. Just another observation ...

Yep—and he was humble and hungry then. He’s arrogant, stubborn, and worn out now. He’ll have next year to prove he still has the fire and ability to field a contender, but I fear he doesn’t.

 

[STL_Cat]

Yep—and he was humble and hungry then. He’s arrogant, stubborn, and worn out now. He’ll have next year to prove he still has the fire and ability to field a contender, but I fear he doesn’t.

He seems like a completely different guy now, in a lot of ways.

 

[Blueathletics]

The system is broken. Time to change or gtfo.

That takes humility

 

[Mad Max]

Hear me out -

This kind of stuff has been talked about here pretty much as nauseam, but not sure this angle has been considered as much.

To me, where Calipari killed the competition from a recruiting standpoint 5-10 years ago was he was selling a unique product. Cal crushed the recruiting trail because he sold playing for him, he sold playing his style, he sold his brand of basketball. We can argue about whether or not the “dribble drive” was just a marketing gimmick, but nonetheless it was a gimmick unique to Cal and his style and he sold it that way. And the recruits bought it. Dudes wanted to play for Cal.

Then he went all in on this “I’m helping solve generational poverty and I’m the program to get you to the NBA” angle. It suddenly became all about the NBA. Which I do understand the strategy, these high profile guys are looking at the NBA, I’ll sell them the NBA. Easy Peasy. The players first, I’m going to help you achieve your dreams pitch. UK players pictures in their NBA jerseys all over the facility.

This strategy has a fatal flaw, though. It made Calipari much easier to recruit against. Once you see a few guys out there killing it regardless of where they went to college, how much easier is it for rival recruiters to say “why do you need Calipari to get you to the NBA? You don’t. You can go anywhere and get the exposure you need these days, if you’re good enough.”

As opposed to, “I want to play for Coach Cal because he’s a great coach and he plays a great style that will highlight my abilities and set me up for success.” It’s much more difficult to sell against a product that has unique features and benefits. When all of a sudden the sales pitch is into “I’ll get you to the NBA,” it’s easier for rivals to mitigate that pitch.

just an early Sunday morning thought. I’ll take my slings and arrows now

Well it’s either that, otr other teams started paying those players and the NCAA turned a blind eye...

was it style of play that drew Cade Cunningham to OSU?

was it style of play that allowed LSU to become a recruiting power?

was it style of play that led to the Green kid to go to the dleague?

was it style of play that led to RJ Hampton going overseas?

the world has shifted.

cheating is OK (for some) and the elimination of amateurism to rush to a bad form of basketball is so obvious anyone can see it...

 

[STL_Cat]

Well it’s either that, otr other teams started paying those players and the NCAA turned a blind eye...

was it style of play that drew Cade Cunningham to OSU?

was it style of play that allowed LSU to become a recruiting power?

was it style of play that led to the Green kid to go to the dleague?

was it style of play that led to RJ Hampton going overseas?

the world has shifted.

cheating is OK (for some) and the elimination of amateurism to rush to a bad form of basketball is so obvious anyone can see it...

You both missed my point AND reinforced it. Guys going to OSU and LSU and Oklahoma because, like I said, it’s been proven you can get exposure and go to the league no matter where you go now. Cal’s “I can get you to the league” pitch is easy as hell to sell against. It’s like if my competitor has a unique competitive advantage over me but all of a sudden decides to focus all their messaging on something that isn’t a unique competitive advantage. Now I can sell against you. You got away from what made you special.

I’m not arguing that nothing else has changed. Certainly it has. But when I think of something like this what I want to do is control the controlables, and in this case it’s messaging. Cal 100% made himself easier to recruit against when he went all in on his “players first, this is the program to get you to the league” message.

 

[jrpross_rivals]

I’m one who is not in favor of Cal leaving now. I think he’s earned his shot. But I don’t disagree with what you said. And I’ll also add this...

This method of recruiting has also brought in the type of kid that want to be a pro right now and will leave after a year whether they’re ready or not. Yes, it’s brought in John Wall, AD, Fox, Herro etc. But it’s also this very method that’s responsible for Vanderbilt, Boston, Clarke, etc. The kids who are overranked and need more time, but instead come in and make typical freshman mistakes without bringing that much to the table and then leave before they ever do the program any real good.

That strategy HAS to change. I’m of the opinion that, yes, Calipari should get another year. But if it resembles this one, the time has come to move on.

 

[STL_Cat]

I’m one who is not in favor of Cal leaving now. I think he’s earned his shot. But I don’t disagree with what you said. And I’ll also add this...

This method of recruiting has also brought in the type of kid that want to be a pro right now and will leave after a year whether they’re ready or not. Yes, it’s brought in John Wall, AD, Fox, Herro etc. But it’s also this very method that’s responsible for Vanderbilt, Boston, Clarke, etc. The kids who are overranked and need more time, but instead come in and make typical freshman mistakes without bringing that much to the table and then leave before they ever do the program any real good.

That strategy HAS to change. I’m of the opinion that, yes, Calipari should get another year. But if it resembles this one, the time has come to move on.

This is 100% where I am.

 

[drew_ukfan_rivals]

Cal was an innovator
Cal is not a adapter

Cal was the first to really embrace one and dones in college. Since others have caught up, he hasn’t been able to adapt. There’s no longer anything unique about Cal for recruits to come. His assistants are poor at establishing relationships with recruits, he won’t hire someone’s dad/brother, he won’t hand them large bags of cash, he doesn’t play a style that gets them ready for the nba, etc

Cal threw out “positionless basketball” to recruits but that really never came to fruition. AD, KAT, etc never developed much of an outside game here. Other places are allowing big men to step out or bring the ball up the court. As you said, other coaches recruited against Cal, I’m not sure that’s really necessary at this point

 

[MdWIldcat55]

I'm surprised these exact sentiments haven't been printed before during the course of this disappointing season, unless you want to count the other 7,000 threads that have said more or less the same thing.

By the way, the idea that Cal has been a one-trick pony and that this is the only way he can win defies history and common sense.

It's not the system that got him to the Final Four at Massachusetts, and by which he elevated a totally obscure program to national prominence.

It's not the system that got him to the Final Game in Memphis, and by which he elevated a mid-major to the top ranks fo college basketball.

So, the premise of many responding on this thread is demonstrably false.

 

[Blue Wildcat]

I'm surprised these exact sentiments haven't been printed before during the course of this disappointing season, unless you want to count the other 7,000 threads that have said more or less the same thing.

By the way, the idea that Cal has been a one-trick pony and that this is the only way he can win defies history and common sense.

It's not the system that got him to the Final Four at Massachusetts, and by which he elevated a totally obscure program to national prominence.

It's not the system that got him to the Final Game in Memphis, and by which he elevated a mid-major to the top ranks fo college basketball.

So, the premise of many responding on this thread is demonstrably false.

What does Cal and UK have to offer that most every college can’t?

 

[STL_Cat]

I'm surprised these exact sentiments haven't been printed before during the course of this disappointing season, unless you want to count the other 7,000 threads that have said more or less the same thing.

By the way, the idea that Cal has been a one-trick pony and that this is the only way he can win defies history and common sense.

It's not the system that got him to the Final Four at Massachusetts, and by which he elevated a totally obscure program to national prominence.

It's not the system that got him to the Final Game in Memphis, and by which he elevated a mid-major to the top ranks fo college basketball.

So, the premise of many responding on this thread is demonstrably false.

Well, the reason I posted this is because the angle I’m looking at this I think is a little different than most others I’ve seen here.

I’m actually not even 100% sure I’m following your point. I agree, Cal was great at Umass and Memphis. I’m a huge fan of that guy. I’m a huge fan of the guy that came to UK 12 years ago.

I’m not sure what you’re saying about his system. I’m not even commenting on his system. I’m commenting on the shift in his sales pitch, which has made him easier to recruit against.

 

[JwUKFan11]

The main problem I think is that some recruits that were highly rated knew they weren’t really as good as their ranking and though they could come to UK to and get a free pass. Even though Cal says he can’t hide them. That along with missing on some of the scouting. But I don’t put that too much on Cal since everybody including the expert evaluators missed.

 

[Mad Max]

You both missed my point AND reinforced it. Guys going to OSU and LSU and Oklahoma because, like I said, it’s been proven you can get exposure and go to the league no matter where you go now. Cal’s “I can get you to the league” pitch is easy as hell to sell against. It’s like if my competitor has a unique competitive advantage over me but all of a sudden decides to focus all their messaging on something that isn’t a unique competitive advantage. Now I can sell against you. You got away from what made you special.

I’m not arguing that nothing else has changed. Certainly it has. But when I think of something like this what I want to do is control the controlables, and in this case it’s messaging. Cal 100% made himself easier to recruit against when he went all in on his “players first, this is the program to get you to the league” message.

I think players who watched the playoffs last year saw the Kentucky effect.

yes, you can get a steak anywhere, but one is from Ponderosa and the other is from a fine Brazillion steak house.

now if someone gave the the choice, I’d take the Brazilian steakhouse. Unless someone offered me $200k and a $400k house to eat at Ponderosa, I’d grab the Tums and run on over.

My point is that Cals NBA message is STRONGER today based on the results...clearly. And that message hasn’t changed. Not one bit.

But you have to value hard work over insta pay. And the money thrown at these kids at Mark Emmerts BLESSING.

Oh and to further prove my point, each of those kids I named would have went to Kentucky of the other guys weren’t paying.

also, Zion Williamson, DeAndre Ayton, the list goes on.

So I ask, why did those kids flip? Was it because of Cals NBA pitch?

No

No it wasn’t.

now if you said the assistant coaches aren’t as successful at selling the pitch, then ask would agree. But there is more evidence of Kentucky creating better, longer pro careers than ever...and kids do notice that.

 

[katwest]

Kentucky going 9-16 is what I can't get over, with a hall of fame coach and a number 1 recruiting class. Kentucky basketball and only Kentucky basketball needs to be the focus here. If the NBA is all a player has on his mind when he comes here chances are he won't be the player he needs to be if he leaves after a year. The NBA will be there look at all of the other upperclassmen playing and winning with a good shot at getting drafted because they are better than the two we had leave, which is ridiculous

 

[UK till Death]

He seems like a completely different guy now, in a lot of ways.

Cal has gotten old. He looks very tired and seems perpetually cranky, even before this season went completely off the rails.

He's right that this job ages you. Its been 12 years since that introductory press conference but it looks like 25.

I hope he surprises everyone, gets back in shape, re-energized, hungry, and all about one thing: winning Kentucky another national championship and NO POLITICAL BS. Otherwise he has got to go.

 

[SmedMoley]

You could have read the rest of my post and actually commented on the content ... but, you chose not to. Why?

He's too busy sniffing Cal's underwear.

 

[STL_Cat]

I think players who watched the playoffs last year saw the Kentucky effect.

That’s great. And at the end of the day, it means absolutely nothing. We’re not landing stud recruits because of it.

His messaging has 100% changed and you’d have to be blind to not see it. Again, he used to sell his style. He used to sell his BRAND of basketball. That is what you call strategic intent and differentiated messaging.

“Come here because I’m the guy that will get you to the next level” is EASY to sell against. Come here because you want to play for John Calipari in John Calipari’s style is harder to sell against because it’s a differentiated message.

 

[JonathanW_rivals]

Cal was being innovative 10-15 with his embracing of OAD. Even the “platoon” was innovative (of an old idea) in a way until we had an injury and he left it before end of season.
But Duke and other schools saw the benefits and jumped in too, giving elite talent more options, and many of those also used the shoe companies to help them with that. (I am glad Cal did not join in on that, and any UK fan that experienced probation understands!)
I thought Cal would also be an innovator in adjusting to the G-league, but he has not.
This years failure was several factors all hitting at once.
- either Cal adjusting to the G-league and less OAD going for more 2nd tier talent or more misses on top talent
- Covid and the limitations it put on early workouts and practices and even casual team bonding, being huge when we returned only 2 players
- with only 2 expected elite players and neither were elite and one played less than 1/2 a season
- no quality PG on the team
- not a good mix of talents on this team, especially missing shot makers
- a big disappointment in one transfer, the ACC top C last year (think KP could’ve helped Sarr)

 

[RKulmer]

You both missed my point AND reinforced it. Guys going to OSU and LSU and Oklahoma because, like I said, it’s been proven you can get exposure and go to the league no matter where you go now. Cal’s “I can get you to the league” pitch is easy as hell to sell against. It’s like if my competitor has a unique competitive advantage over me but all of a sudden decides to focus all their messaging on something that isn’t a unique competitive advantage. Now I can sell against you. You got away from what made you special.

I’m not arguing that nothing else has changed. Certainly it has. But when I think of something like this what I want to do is control the controlables, and in this case it’s messaging. Cal 100% made himself easier to recruit against when he went all in on his “players first, this is the program to get you to the league” message.

I agree that the exposure thing is real. If a player is good enough to think that he can play professionally somewhere, they are starting to say WTF, I'm staying close to home and still get the exposure. Less risk getting recruited over too which I think is a negative recruiting against Cal.

 

[SmedMoley]

Well, the reason I posted this is because the angle I’m looking at this I think is a little different than most others I’ve seen here.

I’m actually not even 100% sure I’m following your point. I agree, Cal was great at Umass and Memphis. I’m a huge fan of that guy. I’m a huge fan of the guy that came to UK 12 years ago.

I’m not sure what you’re saying about his system. I’m not even commenting on his system. I’m commenting on the shift in his sales pitch, which has made him easier to recruit against.

It's going right over the heads. Anything critiquing Cal is seen as an attack and the squad is on you.

 

[kybassfan]

Looks like the CLOD ran out of material and needs to reheat old turds.

Not a single thing in this thread that the quitters haven’t cried about 124575 times already.

 

[tls]

Cal was headed to the mountain top with his 40-0 desire with all freshmen goal. 2015 was not all frosh but it would have met the goal. But he screwed the pooch with his micromanagement from the sideline against Wisky. It’s been all downhill from there and nothing he does is going to recapture what he built to that point.

He almost pulled it off.

 

[STL_Cat]

Looks like the CLOD ran out of material and needs to reheat old turds.

Not a single thing in this thread that the quitters haven’t cried about 124575 times already.

You know what would be cool? If you took any of my points and commented on them and we could have a discourse. I’m willing to have a friendly discourse with you. Are you?

 

[Runnin'Ramel]

Hear me out -

This kind of stuff has been talked about here pretty much as nauseam, but not sure this angle has been considered as much.

To me, where Calipari killed the competition from a recruiting standpoint 5-10 years ago was he was selling a unique product. Cal crushed the recruiting trail because he sold playing for him, he sold playing his style, he sold his brand of basketball. We can argue about whether or not the “dribble drive” was just a marketing gimmick, but nonetheless it was a gimmick unique to Cal and his style and he sold it that way. And the recruits bought it. Dudes wanted to play for Cal.

Then he went all in on this “I’m helping solve generational poverty and I’m the program to get you to the NBA” angle. It suddenly became all about the NBA. Which I do understand the strategy, these high profile guys are looking at the NBA, I’ll sell them the NBA. Easy Peasy. The players first, I’m going to help you achieve your dreams pitch. UK players pictures in their NBA jerseys all over the facility.

This strategy has a fatal flaw, though. It made Calipari much easier to recruit against. Once you see a few guys out there killing it regardless of where they went to college, how much easier is it for rival recruiters to say “why do you need Calipari to get you to the NBA? You don’t. You can go anywhere and get the exposure you need these days, if you’re good enough.”

As opposed to, “I want to play for Coach Cal because he’s a great coach and he plays a great style that will highlight my abilities and set me up for success.” It’s much more difficult to sell against a product that has unique features and benefits. When all of a sudden the sales pitch is into “I’ll get you to the NBA,” it’s easier for rivals to mitigate that pitch.

just an early Sunday morning thought. I’ll take my slings and arrows now

It's no different than anything else in society. After a decade or so, you have to keep up with innovations, modernizations, and the changes in the way people think, feel, and operate.

Cal has to do this with teenagers interesting in playing basketball. Can he? It's now or never.

 

[bigblueinsanity_rivals250340]

I don't think it backfired as much as it ran it's course mainly due to cheaters.

Cal and uk were so strong with recruiting and developing nba guys they were able to leverage out the street agents and leeches. Cal even said after his first season, he put up with some things that year he never would again. On the wiretapped calls, the shoe guy even clearly said if kids go to UK we lose control. That created a need for these agents and leeches to steer their kids elsewhere.

In steps Duke, Arizona, Oregon, USC etc. For Nike the connection is easy - it's to anyone coaching for usa basketball at the time. K sean miller etc. Nike runs team usa basketball.For adidas we don't know exactly how those relationships formed but we saw them play out in wiretapped calls. Then the fbi brought their case and created another need.

That need is now filled in part by gonzaga. We know the aau coach for suggs/holmgren is as scummy as it gets and completely runs the show for their recruitment. Duke and UK stayed away. Gonzaga took him. Also all indications point to the aau coach not even allowing teams to contact chet, except Gonzaga. Now Sallis choose Gonzaga too. Do the math.

Now recruiting is gonzaga, G league, and whatever other schools willing to play the game. So nothing really backfired. The landscape just shifted in a major way that Cal just won't match. That's clear. The question is what does he do next.

 

[STL_Cat]

I don't think it backfired as much as it ran it's course mainly due to cheaters.

Cal and uk were so strong with recruiting and developing nba guys they were able to leverage out the street agents and leeches. Cal even said after his first season, he put up with some things that year he never would again. On the wiretapped calls, the shoe guy even clearly said if kids go to UK we lose control. That created a need for these agents and leeches to steer their kids elsewhere.

In steps Duke, Arizona, Oregon, USC etc. For Nike the connection is easy - it's to anyone coaching for usa basketball at the time. K sean miller etc. Nike runs team usa basketball.For adidas we don't know exactly how those relationships formed but we saw them play out in wiretapped calls. Then the fbi brought their case and created another need.

That need is now filled in part by gonzaga. We know the aau coach for suggs/holmgren is as scummy as it gets and completely runs the show for their recruitment. Duke and UK stayed away. Gonzaga took him. Also all indications point to the aau coach not even allowing teams to contact chet, except Gonzaga. Now Sallis choose Gonzaga too. Do the math.

Now recruiting is gonzaga, G league, and whatever other schools willing to play the game. So nothing really backfired. The landscape just shifted in a major way that Cal just won't match. That's clear. The question is what does he do next.

You don’t think his messaging changed? You don’t think “play for ME, and everything that is unique about playing for ME” is an easier competitive advantage to leverage than “I’m the guy to get you to the NBA”?

 

[GoBigBlue1224]

You have to get players to buy in and believe they are playing for something other than the NBA. They could care less about the history here. You don’t see our players tugging on the “KENTUCKY” as they walk off the floor after a huge win. You see them checking their draft status and looking to the scouts in the stadium instead of looking at their families. Sad.

 

[jrpross_rivals]

I'm surprised these exact sentiments haven't been printed before during the course of this disappointing season, unless you want to count the other 7,000 threads that have said more or less the same thing.

By the way, the idea that Cal has been a one-trick pony and that this is the only way he can win defies history and common sense.

It's not the system that got him to the Final Four at Massachusetts, and by which he elevated a totally obscure program to national prominence.

It's not the system that got him to the Final Game in Memphis, and by which he elevated a mid-major to the top ranks fo college basketball.

So, the premise of many responding on this thread is demonstrably false.

I agree and that’s why, unlike make others, I don’t think it’s impossible for Cal to change. In fact, looking at this incoming class, I wonder if that change hasn’t already started. We only have one top 10ish player and 2 top 30ish players coming in. I think Cal knew full well that with the new transfer rule, there’d be a smorgasbord of transfers that could contribute more than any freshmen could. This next season, if things go well with the transfer market, could be a Cal team unlike any we’ve seen thus far.

That’s my hope anyway. I’m an optimistic realist

 

[GoBigBlue1224]

I agree and that’s why, unlike make others, I don’t think it’s impossible for Cal to change. In fact, looking at this incoming class, I wonder if that change hasn’t already started. We only have one top 10ish player and 2 top 30ish players coming in. I think Cal knew full well that with the new transfer rule, there’d be a smorgasbord of transfers that could contribute more than any freshmen could. This next season, if things go well with the transfer market, could be a Cal team unlike any we’ve seen thus far.

Very optimistic, hopefully that’s the case!

 

[kybassfan]

You know what would be cool? If you took any of my points and commented on them and we could have a discourse. I’m willing to have a friendly discourse with you. Are you?

Why should I? Your points have been discussed into oblivion. Nothing new on the table. In fact that was the only thing of merit. How utterly redundant the thought is. Given that, I commented on that aspect as it was the only thing worthy of discourse. Seems like you were aware of that when you made the post.

 

[track42]

I agree and that’s why, unlike make others, I don’t think it’s impossible for Cal to change. In fact, looking at this incoming class, I wonder if that change hasn’t already started. We only have one top 10ish player and 2 top 30ish players coming in. I think Cal knew full well that with the new transfer rule, there’d be a smorgasbord of transfers that could contribute more than any freshmen could. This next season, if things go well with the transfer market, could be a Cal team unlike any we’ve seen thus far.

I'm afraid that more because Cal is missing on his top targets instead of a planned change in recruiting.