Yeah I’ll have to look that up, but I was thinking that from 1966 to 1975, there were no FF’s either.
Final Four as the Standard
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Yeah I’ll have to look that up, but I was thinking that from 1966 to 1975, there were no FF’s either.
Nods. There have been stretches without final fours. Expecting 1 every 2 - 3 years is madness in these days of one and done. Before 2 stellar classes would carry a team because they were multiyear players. Now we get kids and it’s a reroll every year. Cal’s first 5. - 6 years was a freak show.
You mean the children with potential. Kids. Oh, sorry that doesn’t fit the Cal hate mantra huh?
No Final Fours between 1951 and 1958 (6 seasons), 1958 and 1966 (7 seasons), 1966 and 1975 (8 seasons), 1978 and 1984 (5 seasons), 1984 and 1993 (9 seasons), and 1998 and 2011 (12 seasons).
No titles between 1958 and 1978 (19 seasons), 1978 and 1996 (17 seasons), and 1998 and 2012 (13 seasons).
We are nowhere near a basketball crisis after just a 4 season absence from a Final Four and just 7 years since our last title.
Just because you don't get rain every other day doesn't mean it's a drought.
No titles between 1958 and 1978 (19 seasons), 1978 and 1996 (17 seasons), and 1998 and 2012 (13 seasons).
We are nowhere near a basketball crisis after just a 4 season absence from a Final Four and just 7 years since our last title.
Just because you don't get rain every other day doesn't mean it's a drought.
Wtf are you even talking about? WTH did my post have to do with kids.
That was a total screw job. That absolutely should be a final 4 on our side of the ledger and one removed from UNC.
Explains a lot about your utter failure.
Let me give a hint. Look at the average age of our teams. Then maybe you will realize our teams are largely made of KIDS!!!! All this talent you cry about is most most inexperienced in college basketball. Factor that into your CLOD BS.
I’m going to go ahead and respectfully disagree with calling these players kids. They’re at minimum 18, most of them are 19 years old even as freshmen. You can call them kids if you want but I call that a young adult.
I expected a CLOD spin on this. Compare the average age of our teams with those of every other team in college basketball. We are metaphorically KIDs.
You must get a bonus every time you say “CLOD.”
I’m far from CLOD, whatever that is. I didn’t know there was such thing as a metaphorical kid. I don’t call these guys kids. Our country has made the determination that their age is plenty old to go die in a war, so I’m not comfortable living in a world where we’d do that to a kid.
We’re younger than most teams. That a.) doesn’t make us kids and b.) is a strategy we’ve chosen, not something we were forced to do.
That’s the typical CLOD spin. We are often in the bottom 10 of experience in college basketball. Experience is a huge factor in results. Cal has done an amazing job getting the results he has with such young teams. One has merely to look at Reed Travis, not a stellar talent as a freshman, to see the profound impact of experience. It matters little why we are inexperienced, but the results we get while being that way are amazing.
See Zay about signing up with the CLOD. You seem to have huge talent, though very inexperienced.
I gauge our success by wins. As the stakes get higher in March, it seems less important to me but who am I fooling, everybody wants to when a championship in March.
I feel like I just got transported to a Kansas board.
I'm not interested in the worn-out debate from this thread other than to say that if you're on the same side as Zaytoven, you're almost assuredly wrong, because nobody understands less about statistics and probability than he does. That's including middle schoolers that I've tutored.
I am interested in your minor philosophical turn wrt "dying for your country".
You've chosen to agree with a decision by the government because it would be too horrible a thought if the government was wrong?
I mean, let's be realistic - the frontal lobe is still very much under development at the age of 18. If you put 100 18 year olds in a room, how many of them would you trust to make serious, long term, life-altering (or even life-ending) decisions on your behalf if you were suddenly bed-ridden and had no family?
Maybe 1 or 2 at most? Maybe
Sending 18 YOs off to war has nothing to do with reaching a certain level of maturity or understanding. It's a natural branching point after high school where they have no other commitments (if not going to college), if they die they usually don't leave kids behind, most are naive and many are without great job prospects, so the risk/reward is worth it in a way that it just isn't for 28 year olds.
Nobody is ever really ready for what you can see in war, but least of all the demographic that boasts the highest auto insurance rates entirely based on their love of bad decisions.
Well, I was making a larger point that I don’t view 19 year olds as “kids” and I used the military as an illustration of that thought. But I do appreciate your sentiment and don’t disagree with it. But I still don’t think they’re “kids.”
the system by which the value of a currency was defined in terms of gold, for which the currency could be exchanged. The gold standard was generally abandoned in the Depression of the 1930s
Cal set pretty high expectations when he got here. Remember the talk of perhaps catching ucla etc? The bar was set pretty high, and the bar seems to be trending lower almost yearly now.
I guess he could have said that we could possibly and hopefully win a NC since we did so well after Tubby’s first year and Billy’s time here. That might have turned the fanbase upside down with joy.
I’m not so sure about that. You had to be pretty pretty naive to think that the first several years were going to be the norm. A few Rafters contingent are really ignorant of coach speak and developed the expectations of a three year old. As regards the people I know that understand basketball the expectation is pretty much the same year after year.
If someone walks into your organization and starts expounding on a vision and lofty goals and you perceive those as promises, you should be a little ashamed of yourself.
Ok, young adult...what the hell is the difference? FWIW...
"Some age-related development periods and examples of defined intervals are: newborn (ages 0–4 weeks); infant (ages 4 weeks – 1 year); toddler (ages 1–2 years); preschooler (ages 3–5 years); school-aged child (ages 6–12 years); adolescent (ages 13–19)."
At best they are very very young adults. Aren't physically matured fully in most instances and definitely not mentally.
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Like I say he did set the bar pretty high.
Now that we've had a few lackluster seasons I feel like people want to shift the blame towards fans with lofty expectations all the while giving cal a free pass.
Lackluster seasons...lol
Elite 8
Sweet 16
Elite 8
Falling short and lackluster seasons are two different things.
Go watch last 5 or so years of Tubby and BCG era if you want to see lackluster seasons.
I'm not shifting anything. The people riding Cal just have no realistic expectations because it is FF or Title every year or he sucks basically.
To have opinions formed and based off of if he won this one game versus another is insane. Point being if Cal and UK beat Carolina and Auburn last year, Cal is just fine. It is insane....it isn't as easy as many think. Players will tell you that too.
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No blame, folks are just laughing at fans having outrageous expectations. It’s analogous to the guy that gets pissed off about only being given a million bucks. He’s not to blame. He’s just ungrateful and stupid.
Cal is being not being given a free pass. He is performing the job he is payed to do. He is exceeding all reasonable expectations. He leads the nation in nearly every relevant category. The nancy boys crying in their cornflakes over non-performance by Cal are very comical. I know it’s not nice, but folks are going to point and laugh at the village idiot.
You’re losing me, did he make a statement promising a NC every year? I must have missed that interview.
This,...If Cal had Won 2 out 3 elite Eights he had lost or even 1 out 3,this thread probably doesn't happen
Hell just swap the results of the 2011 UNC game (so we lose and don't make a FF) and the 2017 UNC game (we win and do make a FF) and most of the narrative changes.
Where did anyone, ANYONE, say that it was "Final Four or Title every year or bust"? At this point it's "Final Four every 2.5 years, Title every 10 years"
To be fair though switching those 2 years does more than just switches the years ... it changes the trends.
Seriously though for the thousandth time there’s not a huge downward trend. Two years were Elite8 seasons. We all know what happened in the UNC game. A certain ref had a huge effect on that game. To deny that is ignoring reality. I believe UK and UNC were the two best teams at that point in the season so an Elite 8 game ended up being a de facto title game.
The other loss was an OT game to a very hot Auburn team playing by far their best basketball of the season. The detractors on here say Auburn was without maybe their best player which is true. But they fail to also mention UK had two important players in PJ Washington and Reid Travis who definitely were not at full strength. Auburn even without having Chuma Okeke, had Virgina beat in the FF baring a bonehead fluke play. Losing to Auburn can’t be described as some horrible loss in any way.
The last four seasons haven’t ended in a title or FF but to say this is a sign the program is headed in the wrong direction is just factually incorrect. Virginia proved last year that sometimes it’s just as important to be lucky as it is to having an talented team. And as long as Cal is our coach I’d say it’s very likely he’ll have talented teams.
Few if any would flat out say it...however, it is insinuated plenty.
The funny part is Cal's averages of 2.5 yrs per FF and 1 title in 10 years is well above average in the history of our historic program.
My point is that people are reading too much into the "trends." 2011 was not a better team than 2017. One won one game more than the other. Those elite 8 games could easily have each gone the other way.