Lino/Powers/Hrno

[LeapinLou]

Man, my feelings about these guys changes with the weather. I really wish I could look into a crystal ball and see how they are going to turn out.

Lino - I don't like the fact that (allegedly) he's all about the money and has no love for RU. But he clearly has the highest ceiling in this group. I'd love to get him back and try to get an attitude adjustment from him and his handlers. I'm assuming there is enough tampering and discussions so that he'll know his market value before deciding to officially enter the portal. I'm hoping there is a way to fix this and bring him back.

Powers - I know he's technically excellent, but geez, he misses so many shots. And with no offensive rebounding on this team, a missed shot is basically a turnover. He seems like a great kid that likes being here, but his shooting percentages have to go up if we're going to play him a lot.

Hrno - he's so hot and cold. And his defense stinks. If he isn't asking for the moon, you bring him back and hope you can teach him some defensive fundamentals. But if he thinks he deserves to be paid big bucks, let him walk.

 

[seansherm]

Almost like freshman are inconsistent huh?

I hadn't heard $ was the Lino issue, heard more his fit in a Pike offense (which is weird cause go do your thing fits him best), and maybe didn't like NJ so much.

I think Powers will be more consistent, but no idea. It's his defense that needs much improving for me.

Ideally, you want them back to grow, we can't afford 13 new guys

 

[NickRU714]

Almost like freshman are inconsistent huh?

I hadn't heard $ was the Lino issue, heard more his fit in a Pike offense (which is weird cause go do your thing fits him best), and maybe didn't like NJ so much.

I think Powers will be more consistent, but no idea. It's his defense that needs much improving for me.

Ideally, you want them back to grow, we can't afford 13 new guys

Your last line doesn't make sense.

Mark, Powers and Zrno will cost money to retain.
They dont just get paid 1 year and then free the rest of the time.
I would imagine they'll likely all cost more next year than this year.

 

[RU-ROCS]

Your last line doesn't make sense.

Mark, Powers and Zrno will cost money to retain.
They dont just get paid 1 year and then free the rest of the time.
I would imagine they'll likely all cost more next year than this year.

Not sure what he meant by "can't afford"." But it is not always about the money. We can't afford zero continuity in the roster given Pike's defensive system.

 

[seansherm]

Your last line doesn't make sense.

Mark, Powers and Zrno will cost money to retain.
They dont just get paid 1 year and then free the rest of the time.
I would imagine they'll likely all cost more next year than this year.

Exactly how much do you think they were paid? I didn't say they would be free, but it will almmost always cost more to bring in guys than it is to retain guys, unless you are bringing in worse talent.

 

[RedTeamUpstream94]

Man, my feelings about these guys changes with the weather. I really wish I could look into a crystal ball and see how they are going to turn out.

Lino - I don't like the fact that (allegedly) he's all about the money and has no love for RU. But he clearly has the highest ceiling in this group. I'd love to get him back and try to get an attitude adjustment from him and his handlers. I'm assuming there is enough tampering and discussions so that he'll know his market value before deciding to officially enter the portal. I'm hoping there is a way to fix this and bring him back.

Powers - I know he's technically excellent, but geez, he misses so many shots. And with no offensive rebounding on this team, a missed shot is basically a turnover. He seems like a great kid that likes being here, but his shooting percentages have to go up if we're going to play him a lot.

Hrno - he's so hot and cold. And his defense stinks. If he isn't asking for the moon, you bring him back and hope you can teach him some defensive fundamentals. But if he thinks he deserves to be paid big bucks, let him walk.

I really don’t get this idea that mark “clearly has the most upside”. A few others have stated similar.

the kid can’t shoot!!!! And haven’t we learned by now (since we have a LOOONG LOOOOONG history of scrappy small guards that can’t shoot) that they don’t just miraculously develop a good shot.

And it’s not like he’s this great point who facilitates the offense - setting guys up to score with great assists.

he’s a quick scrappy guard who gets some layups…..we have had dozens of guards like him over the last few decades.

I don’t see it at all.

powers - imho - has a lot more POTENTIAL to grow into something. While his shooting percentage isn’t great yet - one can see the form - and he makes good passes. Plays good D. I see SOOOO much more upside with him.

 

[RRRRUUUU]

We should listen to Cignetti and pay for performance NOT potential. $250k for any of these based on their performance this year. If they don’t like it, they can walk. We hope they learn and get better, but I’m not losing any sleep over these guys leaving. Mark is a bench guy on a bottom of the barrel team, how is worth 5-600k?

 

[RUskoolie]

I don't see what everyone sees with Powers. He has made no impact all year aside from 1 good half in a B1G game. Lino jumps out more and Zrno I like. He can shoot, you can teach defense.

 

[goru7]

Man, my feelings about these guys changes with the weather. I really wish I could look into a crystal ball and see how they are going to turn out.

Lino - I don't like the fact that (allegedly) he's all about the money and has no love for RU. But he clearly has the highest ceiling in this group. I'd love to get him back and try to get an attitude adjustment from him and his handlers. I'm assuming there is enough tampering and discussions so that he'll know his market value before deciding to officially enter the portal. I'm hoping there is a way to fix this and bring him back.

Powers - I know he's technically excellent, but geez, he misses so many shots. And with no offensive rebounding on this team, a missed shot is basically a turnover. He seems like a great kid that likes being here, but his shooting percentages have to go up if we're going to play him a lot.

Hrno - he's so hot and cold. And his defense stinks. If he isn't asking for the moon, you bring him back and hope you can teach him some defensive fundamentals. But if he thinks he deserves to be paid big bucks, let him walk.

Lou, you make excellent points on all 3 . Lino playing a lot more and now starting must do something to let him have a change of heart. He can run a team , can penetrate and drive ,plays solid defense , has been able to improve finishing at the rim and his 3 point shot since USC has been pretty good . Pike per Zinn will have more $ so negotiation and selling by Pike has to close the deal.
Powers does miss a lot of shots and unfortunately it appears he has a green light to shoot , create , drive. He had to rein n it in a little. His % shooting will improve as his form is good and as he gets more comfortable shooting coming off screens. He is a keeper.
Zrno’s issue is pure confidence. Shooters have to be confident. Yesterday ‘s Maryland game was the first game in a while he had no confidence. But with confidence he is capable of hitting3 threes per game so that is a piece you want. His defense is much maligned but it has gotten better all year so the crapping on it is not totally justified. If Pike sells his role he will likely come back as he seems to like it here and likes the guys.

 

[Ru-baby]

Zrno his limited athleticism/defensive ability is the issue. If he returns, he’s a guy off the bench that if he’s hot and making threes you ride it if not, he’ll limit the minutes. Don’t see how success can happen with him as a starting two without some radical change. Yes freshmen will go up and down, but the issues he presents don’t seem to be related to inexperience.

 

[RUDivision]

Lino creates zero opportunities for is teammates! Undersized and can not shoot a lick. He is maybe, possibly a back up worth 4-6 min a half!

Zrno is a shooter who has too many off nights.

Powers size and athleticism is the best of the bunch. He creates opportunities for others and shows promise. Needs to shoot 1k jumpers a day from now until forever to be ready for next year.

All 3 are not ready for prime time and will not be ready next year. You can look to retain at a lower dollar amount. If not you need to let them walk.

 

[RedTeamUpstream94]

Lino creates zero opportunities for is teammates! Undersized and can not shoot a lick. He is maybe, possibly a back up worth 4-6 min a half!

Zrno is a shooter who has too many off nights.

Powers size and athleticism is the best of the bunch. He creates opportunities for others and shows promise. Needs to shoot 1k jumpers a day from now until forever to be ready for next year.

All 3 are not ready for prime time and will not be ready next year. You can look to retain at a lower dollar amount. If not you need to let them walk.

Couldn’t agree more. Even though I like powers (more than the other two) - he is hardly a “must” keep if we can upgrade.

Frankly the only must-keep on this team is Francis (and even that is entirely dependent on his a$k)

 

[RUDivision]

Couldn’t agree more. Even though I like powers (more than the other two) - he is hardly a “must” keep if we can upgrade.

Frankly the only must-keep on this team is Francis (and even that is entirely dependent on his a$k)

Agreed TF is not a 7 figure player!

Powers has the most potential but he is 2 years away.

GM will be key to our success. Hopefully he has final decision on players and NIL allotment.

 

[Shelby65]

I don't see what everyone sees with Powers. He has made no impact all year aside from 1 good half in a B1G game. Lino jumps out more and Zrno I like. He can shoot, you can teach defense.

Jumps out more because he has the ball in his hands more. Mark is more limited in offensive talent and can’t defend 1:1 (same as the other two microguards). He’s worth keeping as a backup if there’s enough money to spread around to 8 other players.

Powers can become a solid Big10 player. Mark’s ceiling is lower.

 

[Shelby65]

Zrno his limited athleticism/defensive ability is the issue. If he returns, he’s a guy off the bench that if he’s hot and making threes you ride it if not, he’ll limit the minutes. Don’t see how success can happen with him as a starting two without some radical change. Yes freshmen will go up and down, but the issues he presents don’t seem to be related to inexperience.

Zrno is the best shooter on the team and is tall. Keep.

 

[seansherm]

I don't see what everyone sees with Powers. He has made no impact all year aside from 1 good half in a B1G game. Lino jumps out more and Zrno I like. He can shoot, you can teach defense.

Powers has two things - great form on his shot, which makes you think it's going to click and he does pass well. He is a respectable 33% from 3 in conference play, not awful for a freshman that started out so poor. Mark stands out because he's quick and handles the ball. He's also out of control half the time and can't shoot.

 

[mugrat86]

I love Mark's speed and hustle. When he is playing point, the ball moves faster and crisper. His shot looks so much better since the beginning of the season as well. I think Powers can develop into a solid player. When his shot not falling, Zrno is just not good at anything else. I am not sure how we could continue to find tall guys who play so small

 

[PhillyRU]

Imo Powers is being limited by Pikes offensive philosophy. So many times he takes one step inside the 3-point line off the dribble and settles for a garbage contested 2, and Pike seems alright with letting him do that.

 

[seansherm]

I love Mark's speed and hustle. When he is playing point, the ball moves faster and crisper. His shot looks so much better since the beginning of the season as well. I think Powers can develop into a solid player. When his shot not falling, Zrno is just not good at anything else. I am not sure how we could continue to find tall guys who play so small

Not sure I agree with the ball moving faster since he's a guy that looks to dribble to the rim and his passes are almost never helpful to getting a basket, with his assist to turnover ratio still like 1 to 1, maybe 1.1 to 1 now? He's better than Zrno at passing, so he's not our worst guard at it.

 

[mugrat86]

Not sure I agree with the ball moving faster since he's a guy that looks to dribble to the rim and his passes are almost never helpful to getting a basket, with his assist to turnover ratio still like 1 to 1, maybe 1.1 to 1 now? He's better than Zrno at passing, so he's not our worst guard at it.

There is a reason he started the last game

 

[bac2therac]

I don't see what everyone sees with Powers. He has made no impact all year aside from 1 good half in a B1G game. Lino jumps out more and Zrno I like. He can shoot, you can teach defense.

Agree he is a dime a dozen guard and Mark easily has the better overall game and future to be pg

 

[Ru-baby]

Zrno is the best shooter on the team and is tall. Keep.

Best shooter? Want him over Francis taking a key 3? Not even close.

 

[seansherm]

There is a reason he started the last game

There's also a reason he only played 16 minutes. It had nothing to do with his passing, or the offense being better. The O was awful last night. His zero assists, and 25% shooting in the paint were part of why.

 

[goru7]

There's also a reason he only played 16 minutes. It had nothing to do with his passing, or the offense being better. The O was awful last night. His zero assists, and 25% shooting in the paint were part of why.

Our guards in general meaning JMike Francis and Lino are all terrible at getting assists and getting the ball to the right spots. Francis has definitely improved his assist rate as he is finally dishing after penetration and not always shooting. Lino is the best of the 3 in penetration and he has improved his points at the rim. He is also an improved 3 point shooter since the USC game. He also plays defense and can stay in front of his man unlike the other 2 . His next improvement is his dishing after penetration which might not happen the rest of the year or until next year or he shows more of it down the stretch here

 

[seansherm]

Our guards in general meaning JMike Francis and Lino are all terrible at getting assists and getting the ball to the right spots. Francis has definitely improved his assist rate as he is finally dishing after penetration and not always shooting. Lino is the best of the 3 in penetration and he has improved his points at the rim. He is also an improved 3 point shooter since the USC game. He also plays defense and can stay in front of his man unlike the other 2 . His next improvement is his dishing after penetration which might not happen the rest of the year or until next year or he shows more of it down the stretch here

They all have huge warts as point guards. Francis slows everything down and just dribbles until someone comes open for most of his assists. Lino just really doesn't pass and has a pretty high usage rate for a guy who only does one thing, full speed toward the rim. He is still pretty terrible at the rim, although the few makes recently are promising for the future. Realizing there are four other guys out there is his next step. JMike just doesn't do anything above average, but he's not terrible at much either. He's also better out of the half court.

 

[Simce91]

Powers

Zrno is the best shooter on the team and is tall. Keep.

Zrno is too often PJ Hayes with an accent

He needs to get much quicker to be successful in the B1G

 

[seansherm]

Powers
Zrno is too often PJ Hayes with an accent

He needs to get much quicker to be successful in the B1G

Cmon, thats dumb. Hayes was a 5th year collegian that shot 21% from 3, made more than one basket like once, and played less than a 100 minutes in conference. The two aren't even comparable other than their whiteness.

 

[Simce91]

You don't feel that 9 games going O from the field is "too often" ?

 

[mugrat86]

Cmon, thats dumb. Hayes was a 5th year collegian that shot 21% from 3, made more than one basket like once, and played less than a 100 minutes in conference. The two aren't even comparable other than their whiteness.

Zrno is definitely better than Hayes, however they are more alike than you portray. Firstly, they are only 2 years age difference, they both are terrible defenders, and they both are terrible rebounders.

 

[seansherm]

Zrno is definitely better than Hayes, however they are more alike than you portray. Firstly, they are only 2 years age difference, they both are terrible defenders, and they both are terrible rebounders.

The age thing is whatever, its this kids first-year in a new country. As for rebounding, yes, both are/were poor, but Zrno, prior to the last two games where he has vanished, was showing signs of improvement w 4 or so in four of the previous 6 games. Like all freshman he very inconsistent.

 

[scarletrat99]

More importantly, Pike and staff have to change their approach from a peanut butter spread to finding the 2-3 best players that fit what he wants and bringing them in, and then keeping the rest who can fit within the budget and style. Mark has improved, but he's a dime a dozen TBH.

Can pike roster build again?

 

[Treaster51]

Lino can’t shoot
Powers shoots too much
Zrno hot and cold and his hot isn’t great

Honestly should be able to get more production in the portal with the money we will have

 

[Bob Chaewsky_rivals]

I really don’t get this idea that mark “clearly has the most upside”. A few others have stated similar.

the kid can’t shoot!!!! And haven’t we learned by now (since we have a LOOONG LOOOOONG history of scrappy small guards that can’t shoot) that they don’t just miraculously develop a good shot.

And it’s not like he’s this great point who facilitates the offense - setting guys up to score with great assists.

he’s a quick scrappy guard who gets some layups…..we have had dozens of guards like him over the last few decades.

I don’t see it at all.

powers - imho - has a lot more POTENTIAL to grow into something. While his shooting percentage isn’t great yet - one can see the form - and he makes good passes. Plays good D. I see SOOOO much more upside with him.

You get it - Powers the best of the three.

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

They all have huge warts as point guards. Francis slows everything down and just dribbles until someone comes open for most of his assists. Lino just really doesn't pass and has a pretty high usage rate for a guy who only does one thing, full speed toward the rim. He is still pretty terrible at the rim, although the few makes recently are promising for the future. Realizing there are four other guys out there is his next step. JMike just doesn't do anything above average, but he's not terrible at much either. He's also better out of the half court.

So yes on Francis - on “this” team. But I’d argue that’s more situational than anything. He’s, without question, an above average distributor in transition (which I know is a limited sample on this team). But if you’ve been watching those limited reps closely unlike J Mike, Derek, Lino, Tez and JY - Tariq never has his head down pushing pace. Yes - that’s why he doesn’t run with quite the same head of steam as some of them pushing pace but TF consistently makes the pass if there’s a guy ahead of him rather than charging into a defender hoping to draw a foul. We don’t have that many players who run the floor well enough to see this that often (and Dortch often missed the lay ups when that pass is made but my point is Tariq makes the pass. If there’s a guard ahead of him, he makes that pass too.

As Goru said - he’s also been kicking the ball of halfcourt penetration more often recently. No matter how much you want the truth to be different - he’s not “missing” opportunities to dish to the bigs. They are either not in position, bobble the ball, etc. it’s by design at this point that this isn’t part of our distribution portfolio. It’s not that he (or Lino) can’t do it. The frontcourt really stinks. Full stop. That impacts all the guards games which is why it’s such a challenge to assess each of their upside. Opportunities do open up if your even servicable down low.

 

[seansherm]

So yes on Francis - on “this” team. But I’d argue that’s more situational than anything. He’s, without question, an above average distributor in transition (which I know is a limited sample on this team). But if you’ve been watching those limited reps closely unlike J Mike, Derek, Lino, Tez and JY - Tariq never has his head down pushing pace. Yes - that’s why he doesn’t run with quite the same head of steam as some of them pushing pace but TF consistently makes the pass if there’s a guy ahead of him rather than charging into a defender hoping to draw a foul. We don’t have that many players who run the floor well enough to see this that often (and Dortch often missed the lay ups when that pass is made but my point is Tariq makes the pass. If there’s a guard ahead of him, he makes that pass too.

As Goru said - he’s also been kicking the ball of halfcourt penetration more often recently. No matter how much you want the truth to be different - he’s not “missing” opportunities to dish to the bigs. They are either not in position, bobble the ball, etc. it’s by design at this point that this isn’t part of our distribution portfolio. It’s not that he (or Lino) can’t do it. The frontcourt really stinks. Full stop. That impacts all the guards games which is why it’s such a challenge to assess each of their upside. Opportunities do open up if your even servicable down low.

I'm talking about being a half court PG, not what they do in transition. Both Francis and JMike usually make the right call there, even if JMike struggles to finish when he makes the right call to take it himself.

You don't need to stick up for Francis when no one criticized him. He's not a pure PG, I didn't say he was selfish or anything, or that he was missing opportunities to dish to the bigs. Totally different conversation on whether we play through the post a couple more times a game, although I don't care who is on the court, make the right play/pass and if the person receiving it screws it up, you get that much closer to that person finding a seat.

 

[mugrat86]

I really hope Lino decides to stay. I think him, Powers and Jones could be a formidable backcourt rotation. Lino has really improved his shot and confidence and is one of the few guys on the team that could create his own shot

 

[NewJerseyHawk]

How can a PG have a decent number of assists with no post up option on offense.....is Dylan Grant supposed to post up and command the ball in mid-post or low post and score .....Are we comfortable saying Mark assists total is 1 to 1 because we arent feeding Ogbole??? Good lord, what are we talking about LOL.

There is literally ONE post up option on the offense and its a 6'5" Darren Buchanan Jr, who can post up, but as soon as he catches the post up, he's turnover prone and teams are immediately sending a double team at him to force him to give up the ball.

The primary amount of assists are based on drive and kick passes hoping Zrno or Powers have a jump shot OR, the occasional Powers drive towards the paint, where he makes a nice bounce pass, hoping Ogbole or Dortch catches it cleanly.

I think we missed about 6 layups vs Washington, should we rewind the tape and count those as potential assists???

Carry on people, these threads are definitely entertaining......not close to accurate, but enjoying the way fans interpret basketball is insanity to me.....we have stat-nerds who cant decipher how many 3 point shot attempts were up against the end of the shot clock or forced up, because there's no inside offense whatsoever, but turn around and call guards poor shooters, as if they're missing wide open shots after others have been double teamed all season long.......

 

[mugrat86]

How can a PG have a decent number of assists with no post up option on offense.....is Dylan Grant supposed to post up and command the ball in mid-post or low post and score .....Are we comfortable saying Mark assists total is 1 to 1 because we arent feeding Ogbole??? Good lord, what are we talking about LOL.

There is literally ONE post up option on the offense and its a 6'5" Darren Buchanan Jr, who can post up, but as soon as he catches the post up, he's turnover prone and teams are immediately sending a double team at him to force him to give up the ball.

The primary amount of assists are based on drive and kick passes hoping Zrno or Powers have a jump shot OR, the occasional Powers drive towards the paint, where he makes a nice bounce pass, hoping Ogbole or Dortch catches it cleanly.

I think we missed about 6 layups vs Washington, should we rewind the tape and count those as potential assists???

Carry on people, these threads are definitely entertaining......not close to accurate, but enjoying the way fans interpret basketball is insanity to me.....we have stat-nerds who cant decipher how many 3 point shot attempts were up against the end of the shot clock or forced up, because there's no inside offense whatsoever, but turn around and call guards poor shooters, as if they're missing wide open shots after others have been double teamed all season long.......

We have not had a true post player in some time. If memory serves me correctly, I would say it goes all the way back to Yeboah. It's amazing how all of our past bigs could not even catch the ball correctly. Certainly, as you say, Dortch & Ogbole hands are stone, so were Cliff's and to a lesser extent Myles

I never saw so many tall players on our team play so small. For instance, our two European players are both 6'7 and 6'8" and neither can rebound. Same could be said for Dortch and Grant who are both 6'9"

 

[seansherm]

How can a PG have a decent number of assists with no post up option on offense.....is Dylan Grant supposed to post up and command the ball in mid-post or low post and score .....Are we comfortable saying Mark assists total is 1 to 1 because we arent feeding Ogbole??? Good lord, what are we talking about LOL.

There is literally ONE post up option on the offense and its a 6'5" Darren Buchanan Jr, who can post up, but as soon as he catches the post up, he's turnover prone and teams are immediately sending a double team at him to force him to give up the ball.

The primary amount of assists are based on drive and kick passes hoping Zrno or Powers have a jump shot OR, the occasional Powers drive towards the paint, where he makes a nice bounce pass, hoping Ogbole or Dortch catches it cleanly.

I think we missed about 6 layups vs Washington, should we rewind the tape and count those as potential assists???

Carry on people, these threads are definitely entertaining......not close to accurate, but enjoying the way fans interpret basketball is insanity to me.....we have stat-nerds who cant decipher how many 3 point shot attempts were up against the end of the shot clock or forced up, because there's no inside offense whatsoever, but turn around and call guards poor shooters, as if they're missing wide open shots after others have been double teamed all season long.......

Stop acting dumb, nobody is talking total assist numbers. All the guards have that same issue and yet Mark is still 5th or 6th on the team in assist rate/assist per 40/assist per 100 possession, any metric you look at. Francis is at like 2.5 to 1, Davis 3 to 1, even Powers is like 1.5 to 1. The team has been getting assists on roughly 54% of their baskets lately, which while not yet average, is much closer than had been prior, think we are at like 48% for the year. Yes, DB is turnover prone, and he has the same asst/turnover ratio as Mark. Badalou has almost as many assists as Lino.

 

[EddieWilsonLives]

all three are currently A10 level players