The two best coaches in NCAA history. (Gives me an excuse to post an Iowa State pic here...)
If Spencer has any interest in coaching
- Thread starter Sullivan
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This is the best explanation of this I’ve seen posted but I’m sure the PSU clown posse that seems to have moved in over here will nit pick holes in this as well. I am thinking that they only come here to argue and gloat about their team just to keep us true Hawkeye wrestling fans from coming on here to try to talk with some positivity about the team we love! It’s getting very tiresome!!
It isn't an advantage if everybody you are competing against can do it too. When comparing success between someone from way back (Gable) to someone of the modern era (Cael) they will be compared to each other based on how they fare in competition against the other teams from the era in which they compete. Pointing out that Cael has a huge recruiting edge because he can watch film easily and clearly does' not show an advantage unless he alone from his era has that advantage. Brands has that advantage over Gable too. Schwab has that advantage over Gable. How is that working out. I don't know how to dumb this down enough for you.
Has anyone ever proved Cael was paying when others weren't? Gables extra scholarships was.
It's not evrn "game film", it's something that anyone, fans included can watch.
Ever hear of Flo wrestling? Everyone can watch just about everyone these days.
I'm assuming you have the internet in Iowa?
My internet is to slow to watch videos on. I was comparing the advantages Carl has over Gable. Gable couldn’t hop on Flo and watch recruits 24/7 like coaches (Carl) can now to pinpoint a prospect. It would’ve been much harder back in Gables era to find the elite recruits.
What you think those elite kids at PSU go there just to sit on the bench and get diddled in the locker room?
It's a fact, they are/were doing it on backside through the nlwc instead of upfront.
Way bigger advantage then an extra scholarship.
For a current example, someone should ask Jayden O’Farrill where he’s living and who’s paying for it.
Internet is to slow
Uh, Ira told me he was ...flat out
BUT, can you prove it?
Obviously resident athletes get paid.BUT, can you prove it?
Of the former PSU wrestlers, Jordan Conaway is the longest continuous tenure with NLWC since graduating. He only came to PSU after Boston University eliminated its wrestling program.
Franklin Gomez (MSU grad) is the longest continuously tenured of any wrestler.
The current roster of resident athletes is split 60/40 (PSU Grads/Non PSU Grads).
There's quite a list of ex-PSU elite recruits have never been a resident athlete.
Cael sure knows how to play it to maintain plausible deniabiliy.
I am surprised nobody ever alleged that Ira invested in DT's M2 Training Center, Bo's ATT MMA Center, or Nolf's new club in Texas, as part of a beyond the backside payment plan.
Lot of pointless rambling in your post, there was no stipulation they had to join the nlwc.
Who cares how long Jordan Conway or Franklin Gomez have been in the nlwc.
It has absolutely nothing to do with deals that were getting made with recruits.
You're just pointlessly rambling about something you think. He is pointlessly rambling about what he thinks. Neither are ever changing your opinions regardless of what is said. Two sides of the same coin.
I am stating things I know to be true.
Alright. I'm going to bite. How do you KNOW? I'm in no way connected like some on these forums are or say they are so maybe you do.
I believe the allegation is that elite HS wrestlers would get paid as resident athletes post graduation (i.e., on the backside), as a deal during their recruitment.
The following obvious counter-factuals to this allegation are:
1) Many elite HS recruits, even those that won NCAA championships, never became resident athletes to be paid by the NLWC post graduation.
2) Many non-PSU recruits have become resident athletes to be paid by the NLWC post graduation.
3) Several PSU wrestlers who were not Elite HS recruits have become resident athletes to be paid by the NLWC post graduation.
4) Many of those who were PSU Elite HS recruits who were later paid by the NLWC post graduation have become USA world team members and medalists, indicating it was merit that got them their residency.
You all are just throwing **** against a wall hoping something sticks. Ira is likely trolling Iowa.
Bob posts with his name on here...that's enough proof for me.
I was in a conversation with the right people one evening during the NCAA Tournament some years back.
Smartest thing I did that night was keep my mouth shut and let them talk.
And in their eyes, it was not cheating but manipulating a grey area.
Nope, I'm not a **** throwing kind of person.
It had nothing to do with competing for the nlwc.
What exactly is your allegation and where was it being discussed in this thread?
I was responding to your wording "on backside through the nlwc,"
I took on the backside to mean 'post graduation.'
I took "through the nlwc" to require they have a formal relationship with the NLWC to be paid by it consistent with its status as a 501(c)(3) tax-exempt, charitable, and educational organization.
That could be camps as educational, but I primarily took it as resident athlete.
Okay but that's not proof or you KNOWING. You understand that, right? That's you allegedly talking to people who would allegedly know saying something alleged. You're not saying something you know in the sense of " I know they did X", you're saying " I know that people I trust to know said X". You could very well be right. I certainly do not know whatsoever.
With your confidence and how you speak in absolutes on this matter I genuinely thought you were going to point to something concrete or legitimate. Shame on me I suppose.
I go back to my initial reaction of the fact you're pointlessly rambling about things you don't KNOW.
I know the people I was in a conversation with setup & implemented the system to use the nlwc to work their way around 9.9 scholarships.
If you don't want to believe it, I could care less.
I don't know you are, who you know, or how you would know them. How could I take it on faith? I'm not saying you're lying. I'm saying that requires myself, or anyone else, to just blindly trust you relaying what you heard someone else say.
For the record, there never was a rule against paying athletes to do camps, right?
I am aware that the NLWC sponsors youth camps. I would assume any wrestler supporting it would get paid.
I don't see anything wrong with mentioning to a potential HS recruit who is concerned his scholarship isn't full that there are regular opportunities to do camps through the NLWC. And if they are doing the right thing, they could be told there'd be no reason they wouldn't be afforded an opportunity.
Likewise, I don't see anything wrong with saying future income as a resident athletes is also a possibility, if world and Olympic medals is what they aspire to and they continue to live the life.
Is that what this is about?
Is that the gray area?
Seems black and white to me that it'd all be perfectly legal. No reason to hide any payment information. No reason to deny having such a conversation during recruitment (except to keep from advertising their strategy).
I am aware that the NLWC sponsors youth camps. I would assume any wrestler supporting it would get paid.
I don't see anything wrong with mentioning to a potential HS recruit who is concerned his scholarship isn't full that there are regular opportunities to do camps through the NLWC. And if they are doing the right thing, they could be told there'd be no reason they wouldn't be afforded an opportunity.
Likewise, I don't see anything wrong with saying future income as a resident athletes is also a possibility, if world and Olympic medals is what they aspire to and they continue to live the life.
Is that what this is about?
Is that the gray area?
Seems black and white to me that it'd all be perfectly legal. No reason to hide any payment information. No reason to deny having such a conversation during recruitment (except to keep from advertising their strategy).
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When a wrestler went to psu, if they stayed in the good graces of the wrestling team and coaches and graduated from psu, the nlwc would pay any college debt after the wrestler graduated.
Wrestlers did not have to be involved with the nlwc to get this deal.
Great way to get a lot of highly ranked guys into a program.
The gray area is doing it on the backside after they graduate.
Yep this has been well known for a while. Not sure what the PSU crowd are all up in arms about
But do you have it in writing by Cael and Ira?? And notarized?!?
spoiler alert: it’s still happening.