Is this a “fair share” of taxes?

fatpiggy

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Aug 18, 2002
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What’s my fair share of all the fraud committed?

Welfare fraud, autism fraud, daycare fraud, Somali fraud, citizenship fraud, hospice fraud.
 
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Rastafarian

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I'm pretty bearish on corporate taxes in general, to be honest with you. I'd like to see that revenue reduced and replaced with VAT taxes, increased income taxes on the wealthy, and increased capital gains.
I’m not sure I understand. You want to cut their revenue or the revenue from taxing corporations?
 

FLaw47

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Dec 23, 2010
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I’m not sure I understand. You want to cut their revenue or the revenue from taxing corporations?

I want to cut the amount that corporations are taxed. It's an inefficient tax that's primarily passed along to consumers and creates a race to the bottom between states and countries.
 

baltimorened

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May 29, 2001
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here's a serious question, could it be that members of both parties who sit on the tax writing committees know more about the working of the tax system than we do? And, that these members have decided that the current tax code - with all of it warts - is the best for the entire system. Now, I don't know the answer but we've been through 5 administrations and twice as many congress' and, short of reducing the burden on the lowest earners, they have kept the system basically intact.
 
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FLaw47

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Sure, if you believe the members of Congress on those committees actually try to do what's good for the country/their constituents and not what's good for their re-election campaigns.

In theory there should be a really strong correlation between "good for your re-election" and "good for your country/constituents". I wish voters would help more.
 

baltimorened

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I don't think that one statistic shows the entire story.. Sure there are a lot of seniors who hold a lot of weath and have good annual incomes, either through pensions or IRA/401 RMDs..but there are also some who live from SS check to SS check.

Remember, the senior deduction phases out with income. So for those who are in the latter case this deduction is needed. For the others, they don't even get a chance to sniff the deduction.

So the ss tax deduction is not really a tax deduction for all..
 
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Paw Pad

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Oct 22, 2001
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If anyone takes a deduction or tries to lower their tax liability, then they have no business complaining. I would assume that number of people to be around 100%. That is all corporations ,small businesses and general people. This garbage has been going on as long as I can recall and I am almost 72.
This is one of my problems with Demorats. They vilify "The Rich", and bemoan about how profitable the bad corporations are. This is so disingenuous because these "Rich People" and corporations fund their campaigns and then nothing gets done
People and companies only pay what is required of them and you can blame ALL of Congress for the TAX LAWS that they enacted.
But it's the democrats who talk about taxing the rich, paying their fair share, and other talking points, when they are just as guilty of the tax code as anyone. I hate hearing all these sanctimonious jerks talk like all these "loopholes" just benefit one certain class. Especially since that class contribute 80% of the damn taxes as it is.
Hey Congress. STOP THE SPENDING!
 
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Chumpsky

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If anyone takes a deduction or tries to lower their tax liability, then they have no business complaining. I would assume that number of people to be around 100%. That is all corporations ,small businesses and general people. This garbage has been going on as long as I can recall and I am almost 72.
This is one of my problems with Demorats. They vilify "The Rich", and bemoan about how profitable the bad corporations are. This is so disingenuous because these "Rich People" and corporations fund their campaigns and then nothing gets done
People and companies only pay what is required of them and you can blame ALL of Congress for the TAX LAWS that they enacted.
But it's the democrats who talk about taxing the rich, paying their fair share, and other talking points, when they are just as guilty of the tax code as anyone. I hate hearing all these sanctimonious jerks talk like all these "loopholes" just benefit one certain class. Especially since that class contribute 80% of the damn taxes as it is.
Hey Congress. STOP THE SPENDING!
They do only benefit one certain class, the elite, wealthy class.
 

baltimorened

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Trump will spend and take all he can. Those that follow will have to deal with it.
we're dealing with it now...$39 trillion and counting. $1 trillion in debt servicing annually. It appears as if preceding presidents might have done what you have said about trump...
 

baltimorened

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The American middle class is getting ****** every which way
great model...but there are some things the younger couple might get that the seniors might not...child tax care credits (don't know if they phase our based on income) dependent deductions..

but the tax code isn't fair. There are so many nuances that people can take advantage of. Wouldn't the example be better with a flat tax? No credits, no deductions..both couples pay 15% of their gross income...$150,000x .15= 22,500....totally fair
 
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FLaw47

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great model...but there are some things the younger couple might get that the seniors might not...child tax care credits (don't know if they phase our based on income) dependent deductions..

but the tax code isn't fair. There are so many nuances that people can take advantage of. Wouldn't the example be better with a flat tax? No credits, no deductions..both couples pay 15% of their gross income...$150,000x .15= 22,500....totally fair

There are only three options if we have a flat tax:
  • Dramatically cut spending
  • Dramatically increase taxes on most people
  • Explode the debt even worse
But maybe I'm not understanding what you're saying.
 

fatpiggy

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Aug 18, 2002
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There are only three options if we have a flat tax:
  • Dramatically cut spending
  • Dramatically increase taxes on most people
  • Explode the debt even worse
But maybe I'm not understanding what you're saying.
Dramatically increase taxes on most people. I think it's fair to note that an estimated 40% of people do not pay any income tax in the first place.

When starting at $0 any increase could be described as dramatic.

It would be nice if everyone had some skin in the game, no matter how small.
 

FLaw47

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Dramatically increase taxes on most people. I think it's fair to note that an estimated 40% of people do not pay any income tax in the first place.

When starting at $0 any increase could be described as dramatic.

It would be nice if everyone had some skin in the game, no matter how small.

Well my quick math says the income tax would go to 15% for everyone (Ned had the same number), which would be a pretty big bump for all of those people who are paying "nothing" (we keep acting like payroll taxes don't exist) right now.
 

baltimorened

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There are only three options if we have a flat tax:
  • Dramatically cut spending
  • Dramatically increase taxes on most people
  • Explode the debt even worse
But maybe I'm not understanding what you're saying.
some people would pay more, some would pay less

we need to cut spending at the federal level. One thing thah we're rediscovered since covid is that the federal government can't manage these large programs effectively..just look at the fraud. And, if we let this current interest in fraud reduction go to it's completion we'll find even more fraud in just about every one of these government programs. Let the states handle the social benefits they deem essential for their citizen..cut the federal taxes and let the states tax the amount they need.

Debt doesn't need to go up...
 

FLaw47

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some people would pay more, some would pay less

we need to cut spending at the federal level. One thing thah we're rediscovered since covid is that the federal government can't manage these large programs effectively..just look at the fraud. And, if we let this current interest in fraud reduction go to it's completion we'll find even more fraud in just about every one of these government programs. Let the states handle the social benefits they deem essential for their citizen..cut the federal taxes and let the states tax the amount they need.

Debt doesn't need to go up...

So you chose to reduce support. That's fine, everyone is allowed their opinion. I don't share yours and don't trust the states to administrate this in a way that's broadly helpful.
 

baltimorened

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Well my quick math says the income tax would go to 15% for everyone (Ned had the same number), which would be a pretty big bump for all of those people who are paying "nothing" (we keep acting like payroll taxes don't exist) right now.
flaw one thing about taxes...no on wants to pay, and no matter what you do, someone wins and others lose....my only point was that if you want fair, then what could be fairer than everyone pays the same rate. Can't have everybody pay the same amount. Those at the bottom wouldn't have anything left after they paid their "fair share"

But, if we wanted to go one step further...below $1 million in earnings flat 15%...above $1 million 20% (picked the numbers out of the air)

It seems as if everyone views "fair share" as everybody else isn't paying enough, but I am...:)humn nature
 
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baltimorened

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So you chose to reduce support. That's fine, everyone is allowed their opinion. I don't share yours and don't trust the states to administrate this in a way that's broadly helpful.
I understand, but what you are referring as support is, IMO, just the federal government collecting taxes from state taxpayers, taking their administrative cut in DC and returning some back to state...or taking money from one state and redistributing it to another.