Best 3x NCAA Champ in PSU Wrestling History
- Thread starter mcpat
- Start date
Don’t know how to even answer this one. Might go with Zain because if he had redshirted his true freshman year I think he’d have been a 4x champ. They were all so dominant this is really tough.
Yeah too hard , not any real separation between the 4 and enjoyed watching all of them equally
And the list could grow next year.
Zain, but like the mystery tie for the 2021 Hodge I wanted to hack the system so I could vote for Nolf too.
Zain. Undefeated his last 3 years. Known to be the team's pacesetter in the room. And the only senior world medalist (champ) in the group.
But it's impossible to go wrong with any of them.
But it's impossible to go wrong with any of them.
Wow. This one is tough. Ed Ruth was slick. Super smooth. The rest were just nasty dominant. Too tough to call. I’m out.
Some comments:
Ed was soooo close to being a 4xer. But Bo was an ill-advised throw attempt away too. And Nolf was a 1pt loss to an undefeated 2xer at that point. Meanwhile, Zain only lost in the post-season as a TrFr to a 4xer and the 1-seed.
Bo was the big moment guy. Nolf was an artist. Zain was Z-pain. That bow and arrow! And Ed made it look so easy. Those cradles!
My list of greatest PSU wrestler ever includes all four of them.
Ed was soooo close to being a 4xer. But Bo was an ill-advised throw attempt away too. And Nolf was a 1pt loss to an undefeated 2xer at that point. Meanwhile, Zain only lost in the post-season as a TrFr to a 4xer and the 1-seed.
Bo was the big moment guy. Nolf was an artist. Zain was Z-pain. That bow and arrow! And Ed made it look so easy. Those cradles!
My list of greatest PSU wrestler ever includes all four of them.
Impossible to answer. For me, Retherford has been my favorite wrestler to watch and was as inevitable as anyone I've ever watched his last 3 years.
Nolf. One of my 3 favorites of all time. He was must watch every time he stepped on the mat.
This one is tough because I would rank all four of these guys ahead of the 4 and 5 timers. Not only that, all four are just keeping the spot warm for Mesenbrink.
Just a small correction. Nolf pinned IMar at the dual before losing at Bigs and NCAA.
If a gun was put to my head I would say Zain #1, Nolf #2, Ed #3 and Bo #4. Nolf's two losses to Imar, especially considering Cenzo beat Imar twice, weighs against him. Had Ed not lost to Letts and to a lesser extent Dean, he would be right there with Zain for me. The way Ed beat up on Amuchastegui in their second match was a thing of beauty. If Ed would have wrestled every match with the killer instinct of Zain and Nolf, I think he could have been even more dominant. That may be an unfair criticism in that maybe I am mistaking Easy Ed's smooth style to a sort of nonchalance on the mat. I have never seen a wrestler get to his opponents' legs as effortlessly as Ed. And once he got ahold of one of your legs, he was phenomenal at finishing his shots. I can't believe Bo is #4 on my list, but the separation between the four is sliver thin. If MM goes undefeated in dominant fashion next season he jumps to #1 on my list. He will have matched Zain's three straight undefeated seasons with less overall losses, and potentially will have won his second Hodge trophy to tie Zain. Here is a fun hypothetical for you: If MM had been a Penn State recruit and Redshirted at Penn State instead of Cal Baptist, does that extra year in the Penn State room give him enough of a boost to beat Carr his Freshman year?
He only lost due to an inadvertent lapse of situational awareness, not a lack of training.
Good point. But if the PSU room had made him better such that he had a big lead as time wound down vs Carr…
Good point. But if the PSU room had made him better such that he had a big lead as time wound down vs Carr…
Mitchell gave up an easy TD three seconds into the match and was subsequently ridden for 1:42. Mitchell also gave up a TD near the end of the 2nd period. Mitchell thinking the match was tied in the third period is what many remember, but Carr's two TD's and over two minutes of riding time advantage is what won him that match.
One thing to add, Nolf won one of his, in pretty dominate fashion on one leg.
Your mileage may vary, but I picked Ruth for 3 reasons:
1. He and Taylor helped Cael start the dynasty. If Ruth goes elsewhere, we don't win 3 of those first 4 titles.
2. Those 136 wins are 5th in PSU history. That goes a long way with me.
3. He had an incredible combination of power and grace. Everything he did on the mat looked effortless.
But there are no wrong choices in this poll.
1. He and Taylor helped Cael start the dynasty. If Ruth goes elsewhere, we don't win 3 of those first 4 titles.
2. Those 136 wins are 5th in PSU history. That goes a long way with me.
3. He had an incredible combination of power and grace. Everything he did on the mat looked effortless.
But there are no wrong choices in this poll.
Super tough to pick one. The stats and team impact are all so similar. So, for me, it comes down to who was most pleasing to watch and I really enjoyed watching Nolf do his thing. It was artistic, many "wow, what was that moments."
I honestly believe if Zain had benefit of RS year as a freshman he matches Cael with an undefeated career and 4 titles
Given then he and nolf were close in weight they also have common opponents.
look at Zain’s results vs Alex Pantaleo compared to Nolfs. That’s a separator for me
1. Zain
2. Ed
3. Nolf
4. Nickal
Given then he and nolf were close in weight they also have common opponents.
look at Zain’s results vs Alex Pantaleo compared to Nolfs. That’s a separator for me
1. Zain
2. Ed
3. Nolf
4. Nickal
The real beauty is the length of the list and an inability to choose.
Nolf. Overall bonus rate
Bo. Dramatics
ZTrain. Relentless pain
Ruth. Effortless
I had Ruth 2nd and Bo last, then flipped them. All very different styles.
I agree with whoever said Ed should have been a four timer.
Bo. Dramatics
ZTrain. Relentless pain
Ruth. Effortless
I had Ruth 2nd and Bo last, then flipped them. All very different styles.
I agree with whoever said Ed should have been a four timer.
Greatest 3 timer: Nolf - Most falls, highest bonus rate. Only real losses were to an alltimer IMAR (IMar turned into 9th grade JV on his back, but otherwise a monster, at 157 especially). Pace and creativity only matched by Messenbrink (without all of the pins).
Ed Ruth was incredible, but in fairness, Amuchastegui was taking it to him before the injury default. In this rarified air, that loss is worse than Nolf's injury default. Injury default is Van Brill's only possible path to beating Nolf. There's still a dent in the floor in Pittsburgh from Nolf's rematch with Van Brill.
Stieber > IMAR, I just favor Nolf's bonus advantage over Zain.
Bo - He just had a few lapses the others didn't.
Ed Ruth was incredible, but in fairness, Amuchastegui was taking it to him before the injury default. In this rarified air, that loss is worse than Nolf's injury default. Injury default is Van Brill's only possible path to beating Nolf. There's still a dent in the floor in Pittsburgh from Nolf's rematch with Van Brill.
Stieber > IMAR, I just favor Nolf's bonus advantage over Zain.
Bo - He just had a few lapses the others didn't.
I was just 3 Natty's shy of being on this list.
He obviously could have gone just about anywhere, but his PSU choice was mostly due to Q promising Mrs. Ruth that Q would keep her boy out of trouble and help him.
This narrative is misleading and it's circulated way too often. Ed was dealing with that loose piece of cartilage for quite a while and it was causing his knee to lock up from the beginning of that match with Mooch. He tried to battle through before it became apparent that he wasn't able to win that battle. As we saw later, Mooch was no match for Ed.
On another note, the one match I'd love to see is Nickal v. Ruth, and, while I'm bringing up hypotheticals, maybe Bo should put the UFC on the backburner and go after an Olympic Gold Medal in 2028.
I very quickly voted for Nolf, thinking that without the injury default he would have had 2 losses, highest bonus percentage and most pins. Then I started thinking about it a little bit more. Without the injury, Ruth is probably a 4 time champ and Zain was in my opinion the most dominant of the 4 and his losses were all as a true freshman. It's crazy that I would put Nickal 4th on the list, when he would be #1 at most other programs. They were all so good.
I will say that this time next year, I plan to vote for Messenbrink
I will say that this time next year, I plan to vote for Messenbrink
This group could easily be your Mt Rushmore of Penn State wrestling.
Agree and Ruth was not be handled by Much before he got hurt. They traded TDs in the 1st period so before Much starting turning an injured Ruth that match was pretty even.
Misleading? I'm just giving my opinion. It's not like I've been subpoenaed before Congress. The match is on youtube. And I upgraded my seats and saw it up close in Philly. I love Ed, but A-mooch was working him. Let's say his knee was really bad. I'll buy that. But it wasn't wrapped and he wasn't limping.
I was walking out of the '23 Rose Bowl and a Utah fan said things would've been different if their QB wasn't hurt. I just pointed out that the Quarteback was hurt because he was running for his life and our defense knocked the living **** out of him. We had something to do with him getting hurt. Likewise I think A-mooch's leg ride had something to do with it. The knee certainly bounced back in consy's against very high level guys: Heinrich, and Lewnes.
Speaking of knees, I voted for the guy (Nolf) who won the tournament with (probably) a worse knee.