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Dan Hurley and his terrible first 2 UCONN years

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preacherfan

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BigRedMachineBigBlueNation said:
While we're praying Pope has a miracle 3rd season Uconn is close to winning #7. BRO we don't have time for a miracle season with a coach who has NEVER proven he can have on in the first place
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I get what you are saying but it isn't exactly easy to find a coach who has proven that he can have a championship season. I looked at both Golden's record and Hurley's record before they were hired by Florida and UConn, respectively, and they didn't prove they could win a NC until they did it.

I find it interesting that both Duke and UNC hired assistants who had never proven themselves. One is basically working out and the other was just fired. UK has had mixed successes with coaches that were believed to have proven themselves. Sutton and Billy G were disasters. Tubby was good but not really great. Pitino and Cal were both outstanding (excluding Cal's last 4 years).

It is so easy for us to post on this board that this coach or that coach will come here but it isn't reality. If Pope is gone in another year, I just hope we can find someone who has a proven track record but I also know no matter who is chosen, there will be weeping and gnashing of their teeth by a vocal number of posters. That never changes.
 
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Ash Williams

Ash Williams

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preacherfan said:
I get what you are saying but it isn't exactly easy to find a coach who has proven that he can have a championship season. I looked at both Golden's record and Hurley's record before they were hired by Florida and UConn, respectively, and they didn't prove they could win a NC until they did it.

I find it interesting that both Duke and UNC hired assistants who had never proven themselves. One is basically working out and the other was just fired. UK has had mixed successes with coaches that were believed to have proven themselves. Sutton and Billy G were disasters. Tubby was good but not really great. Pitino and Cal were both outstanding (excluding Cal's last 4 years).

It is so easy for us to post on this board that this coach or that coach will come here but it isn't reality. If Pope is gone in another year, I just hope we can find someone who has a proven track record but I also know no matter who is chosen, there will be weeping and gnashing of their teeth by a vocal number of posters. That never changes.
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But here's the thing.

How many PROVEN coaches have been asked to come here and turned us down?

Donovan
Hurley
Drew

Are there any others?

Mitch is the poster child for AD futility.
 
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preacherfan

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Ash Williams said:
But here's the thing.

How many PROVEN coaches have been asked to come here and turned us down?

Donovan
Hurley
Drew

Are there any others?

Mitch is the poster child for AD futility.
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For the record, I am not defending the Pope hire. My point is that unless we get another Pitino or Cal instead of another Tubby, Sutton, Billy G, we are going to be a very unhappy board for a number of years.

We can complain about Mitch all day long but both UNC and Duke hired completely unproven coaches and interviewed nobody. And, nobody could have said that UConn and Florida both hit a homerun with their hires to any degree of certainty.

At the end of the day, it is an educated guess most of the time unless we can find another Pitino or Cal who is ready to take the job. That is easier said than done.
 
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JohnRambo82

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preacherfan said:
I get what you are saying but it isn't exactly easy to find a coach who has proven that he can have a championship season. I looked at both Golden's record and Hurley's record before they were hired by Florida and UConn, respectively, and they didn't prove they could win a NC until they did it.

I find it interesting that both Duke and UNC hired assistants who had never proven themselves. One is basically working out and the other was just fired. UK has had mixed successes with coaches that were believed to have proven themselves. Sutton and Billy G were disasters. Tubby was good but not really great. Pitino and Cal were both outstanding (excluding Cal's last 4 years).

It is so easy for us to post on this board that this coach or that coach will come here but it isn't reality. If Pope is gone in another year, I just hope we can find someone who has a proven track record but I also know no matter who is chosen, there will be weeping and gnashing of their teeth by a vocal number of posters. That never changes.
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UNC and Duke both had hall of fame coaches grooming their replacements. Thats really not a horrible plan even though one of them didn’t work out
 
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paulcalhoun_rivals397471

paulcalhoun_rivals397471

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Tim0808 said:
Well the problem with you cherry picking Pope pumpers is that you can not comprehend anything because of your agenda blinders. And you suggesting that someone said he was a head coach for 20 years is a straight up exaggeration/lie. Another stupid pointless effort of you trying to defend Pope. I can't say I'm surprised. The original post said Pope had been coaching nearly 20 years. Not a head coach for 20 years. Pope was a director of basketball operation for 1 year, an assistant for 5 years, a head coach for 11 years which gives him approximately 17 years in the coaching profession, which is nearly 20 years. So who is the stupid liar now, dip****!!!

Read the original post again. Maybe you can understand something this time!

"Give it a rest, Pope has been coaching nearly 20 years and he still sucks ***, they’ll be some no matter what you prove they’ll still see him as an up and comer."
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You just keep on clowning yourself. You know what the implication and deception attempt was. You copying me since you are not clever enough to articulate your own thoughts is funny as is your inability to control your emotions. You think asterisk substituted profanity is being a tough guy but it is just a clear sign of weakness. Stating he has been a head coach for 11 years is not cherry picking it is just the fact. No one counts non head coach years when discussing the head coach. I'm not really defending Pope I'm just defending the truth.
 
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BigRedMachineBigBlueNation

BigRedMachineBigBlueNation

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preacherfan said:
I get what you are saying but it isn't exactly easy to find a coach who has proven that he can have a championship season. I looked at both Golden's record and Hurley's record before they were hired by Florida and UConn, respectively, and they didn't prove they could win a NC until they did it.

I find it interesting that both Duke and UNC hired assistants who had never proven themselves. One is basically working out and the other was just fired. UK has had mixed successes with coaches that were believed to have proven themselves. Sutton and Billy G were disasters. Tubby was good but not really great. Pitino and Cal were both outstanding (excluding Cal's last 4 years).

It is so easy for us to post on this board that this coach or that coach will come here but it isn't reality. If Pope is gone in another year, I just hope we can find someone who has a proven track record but I also know no matter who is chosen, there will be weeping and gnashing of their teeth by a vocal number of posters. That never changes.
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You have to take a chance.
 
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BigRedMachineBigBlueNation

BigRedMachineBigBlueNation

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preacherfan said:
I get what you are saying but it isn't exactly easy to find a coach who has proven that he can have a championship season. I looked at both Golden's record and Hurley's record before they were hired by Florida and UConn, respectively, and they didn't prove they could win a NC until they did it.

I find it interesting that both Duke and UNC hired assistants who had never proven themselves. One is basically working out and the other was just fired. UK has had mixed successes with coaches that were believed to have proven themselves. Sutton and Billy G were disasters. Tubby was good but not really great. Pitino and Cal were both outstanding (excluding Cal's last 4 years).

It is so easy for us to post on this board that this coach or that coach will come here but it isn't reality. If Pope is gone in another year, I just hope we can find someone who has a proven track record but I also know no matter who is chosen, there will be weeping and gnashing of their teeth by a vocal number of posters. That never changes.
Click to expand...
You have to take a chance.
 
P

preacherfan

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BigRedMachineBigBlueNation said:
You have to take a chance.
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Mitch did that with Pope and now we have RR screaming and hollering 24/7 and refusing to even acknowledge anything good. In fact, some have proclaimed this past season as abject failure. I cannot see it that way, as bad as it was.

Maybe Pope was the wrong choice from day one. I don't know. All I know is that it sure doesn't hurt to hope for the best and at least see some of the good things that happened.
 
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preacherfan

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Tim0808 said:
I find it humorous as well. You guys must be kin to Bill O'Riley. The spin cycle. Pope has been coaching long enough that anyone that looks at his record will agree. He is in over his head and is a terrible basketball coach!
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Truthfully, the spin is mostly coming from the side that you are on. I see it on this board every single day. Jasper's uncle posts something on social media and it is misconstrued beyond recognition. The same is true of everything Pope says.

I have been challenged to provide facts and I have done that only to see the other poster change the subject or run away. I have asked for facts and the other poster changes the subject or runs away. It is very humorous because because we even have one major poster who is so arrogant that he can post contradictory opinions every single day and never see the contradiction. And, if that isn't bad enough, his little minions eat up every word he says.
 
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Tim0808

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preacherfan said:
Truthfully, the spin is mostly coming from the side that you are on. I see it on this board every single day. Jasper's uncle posts something on social media and it is misconstrued beyond recognition. The same is true of everything Pope says.

I have been challenged to provide facts and I have done that only to see the other poster change the subject or run away. I have asked for facts and the other poster changes the subject or runs away. It is very humorous because because we even have one major poster who is so arrogant that he can post contradictory opinions every single day and never see the contradiction. And, if that isn't bad enough, his little minions eat up every word he says.
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I am not spinning anything. You ask me something and I will tell you facts.
 
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Tim0808

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paulcalhoun_rivals397471 said:
You just keep on clowning yourself. You know what the implication and deception attempt was. You copying me since you are not clever enough to articulate your own thoughts is funny as is your inability to control your emotions. You think asterisk substituted profanity is being a tough guy but it is just a clear sign of weakness. Stating he has been a head coach for 11 years is not cherry picking it is just the fact. No one counts non head coach years when discussing the head coach. I'm not really defending Pope I'm just defending the truth.
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See, you talk about exaggerations and lies when that is what you post. Then you start making personal attacks when you can not control your emotions. Now you want to talk about tough guys. I guess next you will be crying you were bullied. Pope is terrible and history will always remember him as terrible.
 
I’m The Village Idiot

I’m The Village Idiot

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BigRedMachineBigBlueNation said:
While we're praying Pope has a miracle 3rd season Uconn is close to winning #7. BRO we don't have time for a miracle season with a coach who has NEVER proven he can have on in the first place
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Don’t come at me like I hired the guy. Throwing laugh emojis on my comments and then trying to engage. Won’t do it. I’m very easy to get along with but I don’t play that passive aggressive crap. Come at me like a man with a question and I’ll tell you honestly what I think.

As far as your opinion about the coach, great — cool. Everybody has an opinion. Thanks for sharing yours.
 
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kyjeff1

kyjeff1

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TheApostleSaulSmith said:
Then I’ll eat crow.
What if year 3 is worse than year 2?
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Then I'll say my gut feeling was right, he never should have been hired and my initial reaction was spot on.

You guys are going ape sh*t, I'm just letting it play out.

It's better than what you guys are doing, which is running around acting like Pope hasn't even won a game.
 
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kyjeff1

kyjeff1

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TFCat11 said:
Very nice work!

There’s not a single UK fan that doesn’t want Pope to succeed and stay at UK for 20 years, but the astute, educated fan, saw fairly early on, with major red flags this season, particularly his inability to recruit even remotely close to UK level, that we wasn’t going to make it long term with the program.

That’s one of the main reasons a lot of us knew it was time to cut bait, and change direction, but the AD who took an unprecedented gamble in hiring him, made it so, the next AD would be left cleaning up the mess…

So, now here we are, about 2-3 weeks away from knowing if a 3rd season was all for nothing, or perhaps Pope will find his stride, and make something of it!

With that said… Recruiting MUST improve dramatically, or we’re all just pissing in the wind.
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You are obviously ignoring all the posters that are hoping Pope fails. We even have dudes creating profiles with handles that mock Mark Pope. If you can't see that there is a large part of this fanbase that wants him to fail, it's because you’re ignorant, or blind.
 
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kyjeff1

kyjeff1

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UKBB4Ever said:
Facts carry no weight with Popettes.

Nor do they matter anyway.

Pope should have already been fired. Anyone that thinks Pope can coach high level basketball is just fooling themselves.

He may get a 3rd year to continue to fall down the ladder. He may not.

Some pretty influential people are saying he should go. Some pretty influential people are saying give him one more chance.

I am certain that none of them are taking advice from this website.
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LOL, facts don't matter to you apparently. Nobody is a Pope groupie. If you paid attention just a little, you would understand that the group of people you are trying to make fun of, are just recognizing the situation and aren’t freaking out like little girls, like you are.
 
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Goingfor9

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20MRoster said:
Since there is a lot of talk on how Poop was better than Hurley to start his career at a high major, I looked at their records. Started with mid major and compared only the first 2 years at UK/ UCONN. If you can't see a difference between the two archetypes presented here, I can't help you. Winning % in a vacuum does not tell a story.

Mid. Major:
Poop – Utah Valley + BYU (8 yrs). 187-108 (63.39%). 0 NCAAT wins (0-2)
Hurley – Wagner + Rhode Island (8 yrs). 151-105 (58.98%). 2 NCAAT wins (2-2, wins as 11 and 7)
Advantage: Hurley

UK/ UConn (first 2 yrs only):
Poop: 46-26 (63.89%). Y2 vs Y1: 5.6% decrease in win rate.
Best finish S16. Significant T25 wins vs Duke, Gonzaga, Florida, Tennessee, Arkansas. Matching blowout losses that I don’t need to get into.
UK record prior 2 seasons: 45-22 (67.16%). UK win rate diminished 3.27% by Poop

Hurley: 35-29 (54.69%). Y2 vs Y1: 12.8% increase in win rate.
UCONN record prior 2 seasons: 30-35 (46.15%). UCONN win rate improved 8.54% by Hurley.

Advantage: Hurley for flipping the outlook on the program and making significant strides year over year.

Hurley first tournament win at age 44
Poop first tournament win at age 52

If you can’t see why Hurley (even cherrypicking him at his “worst”) is not a higher potential candiate than Poop, I can’t help you. Things that I didn’t include in this summary include recruiting, wins over expectation, roster spending, among others). I don’t it’s necessary to go any deeper, it’s clear from even a surface look that 1 candidate had potential and the other is trending the wrong way.

The relative trends are pretty damning for Poop – he brought down the UK win rate, and he himself declined by over 5% year 1 to year 2. Hurley, on the other hand, improved the UConn program overall, and improved significantly year 1 to year 2.

If course, if you add the rest of Hurley’s body of work at UConn, you see that Y1->Y2 growth is sustained and plateaus at a title and >86%+ win seasons.

Reasons for not sticking with Poop Y3 and essentially wasting a year of UK basketball are there, IMO. Extrapolation from current trend and general low potential archetype would support a further decline of UK ball in Y3.
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Do you know who Dan Hurley‘s father is? His brother? It’s a basketball family of basketball families with the kind of success Dan and Bobbi’s dad had in high school. I mean he’s one of the all-time greatest high school coaches if not the greatest it’s in their jeans. That’s why I would snatch up Bobbi Hurley try to push out Mark Fox, and put him into Mark Fox role. Pay him Big name recognition alone. I know Hurley had kind of similar success to pope at Rhode Island. It was pretty evident he had that program about ready to make some noise in UConn snatched him up. Pope has had a lot of seasons between Utah Valley State and BYU like 10 seasons he had zero tournament wins. Two programs aren’t even comparable. UConn is definitely the luckiest program in my lifetime. I mean they’re good to get to this final when the other two there’s been a lot of luck involved. I mean, they want a title with Kevin friggin Ollie. Danny Hurley’s perfect though cause he’ll put you in the position to win luck or not
 
BigRedMachineBigBlueNation

BigRedMachineBigBlueNation

Heisman
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I’m The Village Idiot said:
Don’t come at me like I hired the guy. Throwing laugh emojis on my comments and then trying to engage. Won’t do it. I’m very easy to get along with but I don’t play that passive aggressive crap. Come at me like a man with a question and I’ll tell you honestly what I think.

As far as your opinion about the coach, great — cool. Everybody has an opinion. Thanks for sharing yours.
Click to expand...

You support Pope on here. Its not personal
 
BigRedMachineBigBlueNation

BigRedMachineBigBlueNation

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preacherfan said:
Mitch did that with Pope and now we have RR screaming and hollering 24/7 and refusing to even acknowledge anything good. In fact, some have proclaimed this past season as abject failure. I cannot see it that way, as bad as it was.

Maybe Pope was the wrong choice from day one. I don't know. All I know is that it sure doesn't hurt to hope for the best and at least see some of the good things that happened.
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There isn't anything good
 
BigRedMachineBigBlueNation

BigRedMachineBigBlueNation

Heisman
May 4, 2015
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I’m The Village Idiot said:
Don’t come at me like I hired the guy. Throwing laugh emojis on my comments and then trying to engage. Won’t do it. I’m very easy to get along with but I don’t play that passive aggressive crap. Come at me like a man with a question and I’ll tell you honestly what I think.

As far as your opinion about the coach, great — cool. Everybody has an opinion. Thanks for sharing yours.
Click to expand...

And so will I call bs when I see it
 
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paulcalhoun_rivals397471

paulcalhoun_rivals397471

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Tim0808 said:
See, you talk about exaggerations and lies when that is what you post. Then you start making personal attacks when you can not control your emotions. Now you want to talk about tough guys. I guess next you will be crying you were bullied. Pope is terrible and history will always remember him as terrible.
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There you go parroting what I told you again. I was laughing at how inept you are at this. You spent most of your day defending a stupid and highly inaccurate comment made by someone else. Your goofy attempt at trying to be intimidating was a total fail so I was just making fun of the lame tactics you resorted to. I guess at least I didn't get under your skin enough to get the asterisks laden profanity this time.:D:D:D
 
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paulcalhoun_rivals397471

paulcalhoun_rivals397471

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BigRedMachineBigBlueNation said:
I believe it is. 11 years is plenty

You may have not been protecting Pope, but I believe a few on here are blinded by the nostalgia Pope's legacy.
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I doubt it is many if any that feel that way. It is more a matter of you don't just fire someone regardless of who they are after 2 seasons short of utter catastrophe or extenuating circumstances. I'm glad to hear you do not support exaggeration and lying to try to bolster ones position anyway.
 
P

preacherfan

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BigRedMachineBigBlueNation said:
There isn't anything good
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Pitino recently said this about the loss to Duke when Laettner hit that shot: "I took it as a positive." I remember that game and the loss was devastating but, even at the time, Pitino talked about how Kentucky was going to be better. He went on to win a ton of games and a national championship and set up Tubby Smith.

Whomever the coach is at Kentucky, that is the attitude I want to see. Just last night, I told my wife that the 2 of the biggest failures/challenges in my life turned into the 2 of the biggest successes. I can never look back and say, "There isn't anything good."
 
BigRedMachineBigBlueNation

BigRedMachineBigBlueNation

Heisman
May 4, 2015
10,475
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86
preacherfan said:
Pitino recently said this about the loss to Duke when Laettner hit that shot: "I took it as a positive." I remember that game and the loss was devastating but, even at the time, Pitino talked about how Kentucky was going to be better. He went on to win a ton of games and a national championship and set up Tubby Smith.

Whomever the coach is at Kentucky, that is the attitude I want to see. Just last night, I told my wife that the 2 of the biggest failures/challenges in my life turned into the 2 of the biggest successes. I can never look back and say, "There isn't anything good."
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One problem: Pitino is not at the helm. Can't see next year being an improvement but I hope im wrong. I'll gladly earn crow if Pope goes to a Final Four next year.
 
P

preacherfan

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BigRedMachineBigBlueNation said:
One problem: Pitino is not at the helm. Can't see next year being an improvement but I hope im wrong. I'll gladly earn crow if Pope goes to a Final Four next year.
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Hurley is a good example of someone who said to himself, "I can do better." He actually, by his own admission, changed his coaching approach and that is when he started to win big. My HOPE is that Pope learns from this season and does what Hurly did and that is make changes. If he gets it right, great. If not, UK should move on.

The good I see from this past season is that even in the midst of a disaster, we made the tournament and won a game. We had some great wins as well. In the end, the house was burned pretty much to the ground but we can still rebuild!

BigRed, have a great Easter today. Easter is a reminder that there is always something to look forward to! I am attending a sunrise service at my church so I have to run! Also, have a great week and let's hope Michigan wins on Monday!
 
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keiths

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Coaching isn't rocket science. The most important thing a coach can do is get his teams to play HARD. The talent you have, is what you have. Getting them to play HARD every second is what lets less talented teams, win certain games. And love them or hate them, Hurley's teams play hard
 
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