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Malachi stay/go decision Via Jack Pilgrim

BlueWorldOrder74

BlueWorldOrder74

Heisman
Oct 9, 2015
13,844
36,531
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I like MM. please understand this. I do. But I’m having a hard time seeing him as a starting center in a mark pope offense that will need to advance further in the tourney. Mark is pinning his job on this if it’s his decision.

Malachi - as I’ve said many times - is just not overly athletic. He’s a little slow. He is soft. He has weak hands. He get pushed out of position by any big he tangles with. He plays under the rim. He can’t protect the rim. And specifically in a Pope offense, he absolutely can’t handle the Amari role that Pope wants. He’s not a good enough decision maker, not a great passer, doesn’t have the vision to do that. Add to all of this, the kid gets stripped both down low and at the top of the key way too much. He has a very bad habit of bringing the ball down, trying to dribble in the paint, and moves into traffic and doubles all the damn time.

Id love for him to be back to see if he can develop, but he shouldn’t be relied on as a starter if our objective is to get to the sweet 16 and beyond next season. Maybe his junior year, but not next year. We need a C with more skill, more athletic ability, and more ability to rim protect.

All of this is just my opinion.
 
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T

TreyzAllDay

Senior
Nov 12, 2019
192
577
93
anot said:
I know I'm in the minority. The vast minority...but I'd love to have a senior Brandon Garrison coming off the bench. I'll never understand the hate towards him. Is he a great player? Na. But he's decent energy guy. He's not that bad of a player. Especially if Pope can get it out of him every game.


I don't get why he's bashed so much for a energy bench guy. Yea I get it sometimes he came in the game and didn't bring the energy. He's always been talked down on like he is supposed to be our star player.

Senior BG is a heck of a role player imo.
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Yeah you’re most definitely in the very very small minority that thinks that way. The dude has done absolutely NOTHING in his 1yr at Ok st and his 2 years here. He is NOT even worth the use of a scholly tbh. Not here. Maybe at Transylvania??? Maybe.
 
BlueWorldOrder74

BlueWorldOrder74

Heisman
Oct 9, 2015
13,844
36,531
78
TreyzAllDay said:
Yeah you’re most definitely in the very very small minority that thinks that way. The dude has done absolutely NOTHING in his 1yr at Ok st and his 2 years here. He is NOT even worth the use of a scholly tbh. Not here. Maybe at Transylvania??? Maybe.
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Yeah, he’s been rough. And that’s too bad cause the dude is athletic and tall.
 
anot

anot

Sophomore
Mar 27, 2026
137
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TreyzAllDay said:
Yeah you’re most definitely in the very very small minority that thinks that way. The dude has done absolutely NOTHING in his 1yr at Ok st and his 2 years here. He is NOT even worth the use of a scholly tbh. Not here. Maybe at Transylvania??? Maybe.
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He won us a couple games. He's no world beater. But let's not over do it
 
PastorofMuppets82

PastorofMuppets82

Senior
Mar 4, 2025
380
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CrimsonCats_rivals said:
Those “NIL valuation” lists are just estimates of how much a player is actually worth in marketing deals, and are completely unrelated to what boosters may actually be paying them. It’s right there in the text of your link that Dybansta got at least $7 million and Toppin $4 million despite the much lower numbers beside their name on the list.

I don’t have any inside info about whether we actually spent exactly $22 million on this year’s roster, but those kind of lists are worthless for trying to figure that out. It’s entirely possible if not probable that we paid some of our guys more than what they’re technically worth.
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Correct, valuation and and actual pay are two very different things. Potential worth and what the checks cash for are certainly different. JQ valuation was $1.9 in that article for instance. We paid MUCH less than that. But everyone in the media used that $2 million number and ran with it. I only know enough inside information to get me into trouble on this board. Not close enough to know everything, but not far enough removed to pretend like I know nothing with a straight face.
 
D

Dward13

All-Conference
Feb 5, 2008
10,171
1,505
72
JSquad0070 said:
I agree he should be a big part, but we need a center than can actually grab a tough rebound and not lose the ball consistently. A rim protector would be nice too.
Click to expand...

I think you need an elite point guard first. Efficient, low turnover rate, good shooter snd decision maker, good defender. He doesn’t need to be Darius Acuff, Tyler Ulis, SGA level. But he’s gotta be an all conference level player.

After that, we need what you said. multiple bigs that can rebound and rim protect. Realistically only one of Garrison or Moreno should be invited back. And Moreno outperformed Garrison for most of the season despite being a freshman.

Next up should be shooting guards and wings that can you know, shoot the ball.
 
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Madhuvan

Madhuvan

Junior
Aug 11, 2024
139
315
63
FitchandMurray29 said:
My guess is the core playing returning group of Moreno/Kam/Chandler, will probably cost 5.5-7M total.

Moreno will be between 2-3. Chandler between 1.5-2.5. Kam between 1.25 and 1.75.

That leaves us at least 2 3M type Stokes/portal/overseas additions and more selective budget conscious depth.
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I’d love to have Chandler and Williams back but right now they are two totally one dimensional players. I think you could get what they bring for less than $4M total. Unless we just have money to burn and don’t care about the budget.
 
BlueSince92

BlueSince92

All-Conference
Jul 2, 2025
10,459
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“was among the lowest paid on the team in terms of rotation pieces”

Is there any way in which we didn’t misuse that twenty-two million dollars?
 
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R

rivercatinfl

All-Conference
Nov 21, 2012
1,977
1,874
97
KyLegacyBBN said:
I wouldn’t mind seeing what a second year Moreno could become. I’m also skeptical of Popes ability to get the most out of him.
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I'm skeptical of Morenos drive to be a top talent. He just seems so laid back. Garrison had more fire to his game.
 
R

rivercatinfl

All-Conference
Nov 21, 2012
1,977
1,874
97
Farsight Clone said:
The problem is that Pope is the coach. Moreno under Purdue's coach or Rick or anyone else he would be a higher caliber player. They wouldn't put up with his laziness and softness. They would correct it.

Because we don't have anyone coming in next year, and Pope is the Whiff Master, we need Moreno back. I think the guy has a ton of potential.
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Sorry. I call BS on that. Moreno needs some fire in his belly. He is very soft.
 
R

rivercatinfl

All-Conference
Nov 21, 2012
1,977
1,874
97
Farsight Clone said:
Really? Zuby Ejofor says hello. Pitino made him a top 3 player on his team vs when he played for Kansas.

The coach is responsible to help facilitate a mentality. So its on Moreno and the coach.

And? Ben McCollum says hello.

Click to expand...

I hear you but Moreno has to put forth the effort. How do you know what they have tried to work with Moreno on this year.
He's a sullen kind of guy and that transfers to his play on the court.
Everyone sees his lack of post moves and rebounding deficits.
He's got the tools but HE has to put forth the effort in addition to the coaching staff.
I realize he is freshman but the man has played a lot of basketball to be a mediocre rebounder and scorer at 7'.
 
Reggie Noble

Reggie Noble

Sophomore
Jul 5, 2025
134
175
43
CrimsonCats_rivals said:
Those “NIL valuation” lists are just estimates of how much a player is actually worth in marketing deals, and are completely unrelated to what boosters may actually be paying them. It’s right there in the text of your link that Dybansta got at least $7 million and Toppin $4 million despite the much lower numbers beside their name on the list.

I don’t have any inside info about whether we actually spent exactly $22 million on this year’s roster, but those kind of lists are worthless for trying to figure that out. It’s entirely possible if not probable that we paid some of our guys more than what they’re technically worth.
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It's like he didn't read the article that he posted.
 
PastorofMuppets82

PastorofMuppets82

Senior
Mar 4, 2025
380
848
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Reggie Noble said:
It's like he didn't read the article that he posted.
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It's almost like you don't know the difference between valuation, potential growth, and actual pay. But I wouldn't expect someone without a business degree to understand fully anyways. Just because an item has an MSRP doesn't mean that is what I pay for it, and just because I paid less than MSRP doesn't mean it doesn't gain value after purchase.

The market values you at $2 million.
Team A) offers you $1.9 million in NIL and a car of your choice, paid out weekly, after taxes
Team B) offers you $1 million in Bitcoin and a car of your choice, paid immediately upon signing
Team C) offers you $2.2 million, half now in cash, half in bitcoin at the beginning of the second semester

Which team offered the most?
 
K

KyWideWes

Junior
Dec 11, 2025
105
202
43
BlueWorldOrder74 said:
I like MM. please understand this. I do. But I’m having a hard time seeing him as a starting center in a mark pope offense that will need to advance further in the tourney. Mark is pinning his job on this if it’s his decision.

Malachi - as I’ve said many times - is just not overly athletic. He’s a little slow. He is soft. He has weak hands. He get pushed out of position by any big he tangles with. He plays under the rim. He can’t protect the rim. And specifically in a Pope offense, he absolutely can’t handle the Amari role that Pope wants. He’s not a good enough decision maker, not a great passer, doesn’t have the vision to do that. Add to all of this, the kid gets stripped both down low and at the top of the key way too much. He has a very bad habit of bringing the ball down, trying to dribble in the paint, and moves into traffic and doubles all the damn time.

Id love for him to be back to see if he can develop, but he shouldn’t be relied on as a starter if our objective is to get to the sweet 16 and beyond next season. Maybe his junior year, but not next year. We need a C with more skill, more athletic ability, and more ability to rim protect.

All of this is just my opinion.
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You definitely have to scheme him but also he made a good jump from his senior year of hs to this year. He seems to have a good work ethic and he has a good feel for the game. I agree with you that running high action with him like we did this year is not very effective. You need a shooter, rim runner, or plus passer there. We really need a good stretch 4 to do that and have MM in the dunker spot or post ups.
 
Reggie Noble

Reggie Noble

Sophomore
Jul 5, 2025
134
175
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PastorofMuppets82 said:
It's almost like you don't know the difference between valuation, potential growth, and actual pay. But I wouldn't expect someone without a business degree to understand fully anyways. Just because an item has an MSRP doesn't mean that is what I pay for it, and just because I paid less than MSRP doesn't mean it doesn't gain value after purchase.

The market values you at $2 million.
Team A) offers you $1.9 million in NIL and a car of your choice, paid out weekly, after taxes
Team B) offers you $1 million in Bitcoin and a car of your choice, paid immediately upon signing
Team C) offers you $2.2 million, half now in cash, half in bitcoin at the beginning of the second semester

Which team offered the most?
Click to expand...
LOL, AI is a wonderful thing but I can answer an AI question just as easily as you can ask it?

Team C offered the most on paper. Team B might end up being worth the most later. Team A is the safest guaranteed net pay.
Those are three different things.


You’re mixing up present compensation, future appreciation, and market valuation like they’re the same metric. They’re not.


  • Valuation = what the market says you’re worth
  • Offer/pay = what you actually receive at signing/in contract terms
  • Growth/upside = what an asset might become later

So if we’re answering “who offered the most?” in the normal NIL sense, it’s Team C at $2.2M.
If we’re asking “which could become worth the most later?”, then Bitcoin introduces upside, but that’s speculation, not higher guaranteed pay.
 
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PastorofMuppets82

PastorofMuppets82

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Mar 4, 2025
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Too dumb to realize I didn't ask an AI question, too simple to use his own brain instead of AI. Tell me you're 12 and rely on chat GPT without telling me you're 12. I love this fanbase.
 
Delk4three

Delk4three

Senior
Jul 1, 2004
387
595
93
KyWideWes said:
You definitely have to scheme him but also he made a good jump from his senior year of hs to this year. He seems to have a good work ethic and he has a good feel for the game. I agree with you that running high action with him like we did this year is not very effective. You need a shooter, rim runner, or plus passer there. We really need a good stretch 4 to do that and have MM in the dunker spot or post ups.
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Honestly, in the modern game, I would start/play mostly with 2 4's for most of the game. Guys that have some height, but are athletic enough to guard multiple positions, handle the ball some and have a perimeter game.
 
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J

JonathanW2

Senior
Aug 6, 2025
414
615
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BlueWorldOrder74 said:
I like MM. please understand this. I do. But I’m having a hard time seeing him as a starting center in a mark pope offense that will need to advance further in the tourney. Mark is pinning his job on this if it’s his decision.

Malachi - as I’ve said many times - is just not overly athletic. He’s a little slow. He is soft. He has weak hands. He get pushed out of position by any big he tangles with. He plays under the rim. He can’t protect the rim. And specifically in a Pope offense, he absolutely can’t handle the Amari role that Pope wants. He’s not a good enough decision maker, not a great passer, doesn’t have the vision to do that. Add to all of this, the kid gets stripped both down low and at the top of the key way too much. He has a very bad habit of bringing the ball down, trying to dribble in the paint, and moves into traffic and doubles all the damn time.

Id love for him to be back to see if he can develop, but he shouldn’t be relied on as a starter if our objective is to get to the sweet 16 and beyond next season. Maybe his junior year, but not next year. We need a C with more skill, more athletic ability, and more ability to rim protect.

All of this is just my opinion.
Click to expand...
Moreno was a FR. Most FR are not strong YET.
You usually see the biggest improvement in players from FR to SOPH year, but in big men I think you often see 2 positive leaps forward (FR to SOPH, & SOPH to JR).
He wasn't brought in to start, he was brought in to back up Garrison the first 2 months, and then be 3rd string that last half of the season.

You say he can't project the rim, yet he averaged 1.5 blks in 22.6min, that is 2.0 blk per30min. Better than Nick Richards FR year.
And his rebounding 8.4 p30m was better than WCS (all 3 years), better than Bam (8.0 p30m), better than Richards Soph & JR years, & better than MoD this year.
He isn't the passer that Amari was, but who is? I've not seen another 7-footer pass like that in college in the past 40 years. MM averaged 1.8 ast (2.4 p30m), and I think was probably closer to 3 p30m the 2nd half of the season. Not bad.

But if we can keep MM, and I hope we do, then I do agree that the other C we have needs to be a more defensive minded C.
 
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Vek96

Vek96

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Uh, believe it or not, players can improve from year to year. That being said, 8 would ask him what he needs, and if it’s not some crazy amount, give it to him. If it is, then wish him well.

Not really complicated.
 
LineSkiCat14

LineSkiCat14

Heisman
Aug 5, 2015
38,815
60,838
113
Id want him back. He declined in the 2nd half of the year, but he showed lots of promise at various points. I think he will be a good big in a year or two.
 
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BlueBloodKyFan73

BlueBloodKyFan73

All-Conference
Oct 29, 2010
3,757
4,599
113
FitchandMurray29 said:
Let’s see if I can get to 22 on back of the napkin math:

-Oweh 4
-Lowe-3
-JQ-2
-Aberdeen 2
-Mo 2
-Kam 1.5
-Garrison 1 plus
-Chandler 1
-Moreno 1
-Jelavic 1
- Jasper 1.5
-Noah 750k
-Hawthorne and Potter combined 500k

I get pretty close to 22…bare minimum in my mind was high teens.
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I know your just crunching numbers if they paid this rationally then yikes what analytics site or software were they using because 95% of these players are 6th man or role players
 
BlueSince92

BlueSince92

All-Conference
Jul 2, 2025
10,459
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230
PastorofMuppets82 said:
It's almost like you don't know the difference between valuation, potential growth, and actual pay. But I wouldn't expect someone without a business degree to understand fully anyways. Just because an item has an MSRP doesn't mean that is what I pay for it, and just because I paid less than MSRP doesn't mean it doesn't gain value after purchase.

The market values you at $2 million.
Team A) offers you $1.9 million in NIL and a car of your choice, paid out weekly, after taxes
Team B) offers you $1 million in Bitcoin and a car of your choice, paid immediately upon signing
Team C) offers you $2.2 million, half now in cash, half in bitcoin at the beginning of the second semester

Which team offered the most?
Click to expand...
Car of my choice is a Ferrari 166 MM Barchetta valued anywhere between $4 million and $10 million so Team A) definitely paid the most and I'll do almost anything they want on- or off-court.
 
BlueBloodKyFan73

BlueBloodKyFan73

All-Conference
Oct 29, 2010
3,757
4,599
113
Tri-Countycat said:
He need to be on the team and really needs HIT training and get on the leap machine. If he can improve his athleticism just by 10% it would help. He will get older, meaner and stronger likely.
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Needs a jump shot and ball handling more than anything he clogs the lane for people trying to drive the lane
 
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BlueBloodKyFan73

BlueBloodKyFan73

All-Conference
Oct 29, 2010
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113
JPFisher said:
Easy, take the money we spent on JQ and give half or a third or whatever to MM. While we're at it, we can cut Garrison's share and put whatever is left in toward a couple stretch bigs.
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The best stretch 4 big is already in the portal and that’s Paulius Murauskas he’s easily gonna cost 2.5 - 3 I think he follows his coach to ASU though
 
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Delk4three

Delk4three

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Jul 1, 2004
387
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BlueBloodKyFan73 said:
Needs a jump shot and ball handling more than anything he clogs the lane for people trying to drive the lane
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Yeah, he is more of a 90's big. In this modern game, I don't think he has the skills, at least not as a big minute player. I'd rather get a 6'9 power forward type, that can handle and has some outside game to be the starting 5.
 
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dynastydreamuk

dynastydreamuk

All-Conference
Nov 18, 2010
1,852
1,388
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19CatOfBlueBlood96 said:
Wish somto would come back
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I really like Cyril Somto's game and was my only regret when Cal left was knowing I wouldn't get to see him in Blue. He has become the player I thought he would but at a high major program he would play the backup bruiser rebound defend role 15 min a game guy...not a starter. He would probably be a good contrast to split minutes with Moreno, picking which guy is right for what game...but cyril probably isnt playing backup unless the money is right

JSquad0070 said:
I agree he should be a big part, but we need a center than can actually grab a tough rebound and not lose the ball consistently. A rim protector would be nice too.
Click to expand...

Maybe Cyril Somto behind Moreno? Haha

K_TIME said:
So why is this hard

1. You have Quantenance allegedly making 2M to do zilch….and why we paid Garrison at all was more Pope buffoonary..:there is plenty to pay Moreno without increasing the budget

2. The big decision is Moreno a five out offense center in time. Csn he handle end pass to initiate offense….or is there a better big out there for this team

But rhe money should not be an issue
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I would love to have Moreno back but I dont think he is worth like super high money... I never saw anything too special and at the end in March when it mattered Garrison out played him. So if the Moreno camp wants something unreasonable like $2 million ...this is the era where you may have to let him walk even if he is a kentucky boy and fan favorite.

He isnt that athletic and thats the part that doesnt improve...and his "hands" sometimes that is also just in the player and is hard to improve. He can get stronger and stuff but may not actually improve the tangible part that seems to be him losing balls and silly kind of little stuff.
 
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B

bnewt5

Junior
Feb 17, 2026
289
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Ukwazoo3 said:
Moreno was pretty good as a freshman and will be pretty good next year, if not better. He definitely hit the wall at the end, but he will be a stud by the time he's an upperclassman.

In the words of Teddy KGB, pay that man his money.
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He was decent
Not much offense
Not much of rebounder
Poor Shot blocker
 
*Fox2Monk*

*Fox2Monk*

Heisman
Jun 10, 2009
44,707
80,486
113
JPScott said:
I thought his hands were pretty good halfway through the season, but he definitely regressed down the stretch. So many times he failed to grab a key rebound which was in his grasp or he got stripped.
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That tourney game made me furious. Me and @Cowtown Cat were in the game thread seething every time a rebound fell 2 feet from him and he didn’t grab it. He was moving so slow.
 
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BlueWorldOrder74

BlueWorldOrder74

Heisman
Oct 9, 2015
13,844
36,531
78
JonathanW2 said:
Moreno was a FR. Most FR are not strong YET.
You usually see the biggest improvement in players from FR to SOPH year, but in big men I think you often see 2 positive leaps forward (FR to SOPH, & SOPH to JR).
He wasn't brought in to start, he was brought in to back up Garrison the first 2 months, and then be 3rd string that last half of the season.

You say he can't project the rim, yet he averaged 1.5 blks in 22.6min, that is 2.0 blk per30min. Better than Nick Richards FR year.
And his rebounding 8.4 p30m was better than WCS (all 3 years), better than Bam (8.0 p30m), better than Richards Soph & JR years, & better than MoD this year.
He isn't the passer that Amari was, but who is? I've not seen another 7-footer pass like that in college in the past 40 years. MM averaged 1.8 ast (2.4 p30m), and I think was probably closer to 3 p30m the 2nd half of the season. Not bad.

But if we can keep MM, and I hope we do, then I do agree that the other C we have needs to be a more defensive minded C.
Click to expand...
Ok. Nice research. Still stand by what my eyes showed me when he faced real comp. Not trying to be a dick to you or Malachi, as I said, I’d like him to return, just not as a starter.
 
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