One of nine 9’s
- Thread starter LaQuintaHawk
- Start date
I saw that earlier and will think the same thing. When in the world was DePaul good at anything?
No I don't want the history lesson with it. This was before I was born.
No I don't want the history lesson with it. This was before I was born.
Mark Aguirre was the number one pick in the draft then, they were really good.
DePaul was "Chicago's Team" before Northwestern football tried to steal that moniker once DePaul's basketball program fell off the cliff.
So by tying yourself with the city of Chicago you just automatically under perform?
How do 8's do? I found this completely shocking that 9s have gone only about a dozen times. A lot of years all #1s make it to the next week, but I would have guessed it was more likely one of the four lost in the second round than all four going most years. The 8/9 spots are all pretty good teams that either were ranked at the end of the season, or likely were at some point. Even 16's have won twice now!
Edit: I looked it up. 8's beat a #1 16 times. And they only overlapped one time. So in 25 tournaments of 47 a #1 didn't advance to the Sweet 16. So still more likely that at least one loses vs all four making it, but barely. Also interesting note, each time a 16 DID win, a different #1 lost in the second round as well.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_Division_I_men's_basketball_tournament_upsets
Edit: I looked it up. 8's beat a #1 16 times. And they only overlapped one time. So in 25 tournaments of 47 a #1 didn't advance to the Sweet 16. So still more likely that at least one loses vs all four making it, but barely. Also interesting note, each time a 16 DID win, a different #1 lost in the second round as well.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_Division_I_men's_basketball_tournament_upsets
Last edited:
Also to further the historical data a little more here, 5 of the 8 #9s that advanced continued on to the elite 8. Those numbers are a little different but I also realized that page on wikipedia only includes the era of a full 64 team tournament. The first 3 teams in the OPs chart won when the high seeds still had first round byes.
Didn't they hire his son to replace him and it was all downhill from there? I could be thinking of someone else.
You are correct.....it was Joey Meyer. Joey actually had some success initially, but yeah, eventually the wheels fell off.
Used to watch those Depaul teams on WGN back in the day. Loved Rod Strickland
of the nine 9-seeds to have beaten a number 1-seed in the ncaa mens basketball tourney, how many won their next game?
Google says:
Based on historical NCAA tournament data, out of the nine 9-seeds that have historically defeated a number 1-seed (a rare occurrence),
zero of them went on to win their next game (the Sweet 16). They have traditionally lost to the 4, 5, or other surviving seeds in the following round.
Ben do something legenday.
Google says:
Based on historical NCAA tournament data, out of the nine 9-seeds that have historically defeated a number 1-seed (a rare occurrence),
zero of them went on to win their next game (the Sweet 16). They have traditionally lost to the 4, 5, or other surviving seeds in the following round.
Ben do something legenday.
I think you need to lump 8 and 9 seeds together because they're so close. I think there's been a decent amount of 8 seeds that have won their next games after beating a 1 seed.
In fact, it looks like 8 seeds are 7-3 in sweet 16 games after beating a 1 seed in the previous round. So there's that.
Another interesting nugget....we are only the 6th 9 seed to ever beat a 1 seed in the NCAA tourney since the expansion to 64 teams in the 80's. Conversely, 8 seeds are 16-61 against 1 seeds in the tournament. But overall, 9 seeds have a winning record against 8 seeds when they play in the first round. That's why you need to include 8 seeds in your search of how teams have performed when beating a 1 seed.
Just in the last 15 years, I think three 8 seeds have made the championship game....at least that I can recall. Butler, Kentucky, and North Carolina.
After seeing that data, since there is very little difference between 8 and 9 seeds, I was curious how many 1-seeds have been upset in the second round, so I asked Google AI. Here's what I got, which also had a couple more than weren't on Norlander's list:
Since the NCAA tournament first began seeding in 1979, No. 1 seeds have been upset in the Round of 32 a total of 28 times.
While No. 1 seeds have been historically dominant in the first round (158–2 record), the second round has proven much more dangerous. On average, a No. 1 seed has lost in the Round of 32 roughly once every other year.
Since seeding began in 1979, No. 1 seeds have been upset in the Round of 32 exactly 28 times. These upsets were pulled off by either No. 8 or No. 9 seeds. Here is the complete chronological list of those 28 upsets:
Upsets by No. 8 Seeds (17 Total)
| Year | Winner (8 Seed) | Loser (1 Seed) |
|---|---|---|
| 2023 | Arkansas | Kansas |
| 2022 | North Carolina | Baylor |
| 2021 | Loyola Chicago | Illinois |
| 2017 | Wisconsin | Villanova |
| 2014 | Kentucky | Wichita State |
| 2011 | Butler | Pittsburgh |
| 2004 | Alabama | Stanford |
| 2002 | UCLA | Cincinnati |
| 2000 | North Carolina | Stanford |
| 2000 | Wisconsin | Arizona |
| 1998 | West Virginia | Cincinnati |
| 1996 | Georgia | Purdue |
| 1990 | North Carolina | Oklahoma |
| 1987 | Auburn | Indiana |
| 1986 | Auburn | St. John's |
| 1982 | St. Joseph's | DePaul |
| 1980 | UCLA | DePaul |
Upsets by No. 9 Seeds (11 Total)
| Year | Winner (9 Seed) | Loser (1 Seed) |
|---|---|---|
| 2026 | Iowa | Florida |
| 2018 | Florida State | Xavier |
| 2013 | Wichita State | Gonzaga |
| 2010 | Northern Iowa | Kansas |
| 2004 | UAB | Kentucky |
| 1999 | Auburn | Purdue |
| 1994 | Boston College | North Carolina |
| 1992 | UTEP | Kansas |
| 1983 | James Madison | West Virginia |
| 1981 | Saint Joseph's | DePaul |
| 1979 | Penn | North Carolina |
Last edited:
They were must watch back in day. Largely because they had some great players, and their Coach (Ray Meyer) was a character. But the most important part was I believe all their games were played on WGN cable out of Chicago, had a nationwide reach.
They were must watch back in day. Largely because they had some great players, and their Coach (Ray Meyer) was a character. But the most important part was I believe all their games were played on WGN cable out of Chicago, had a nationwide reach.
Everybody knew about Depaul Basketball in those days.
'77-'84 - only two seasons where they lost more than 3 games
Short history lesson. In 1979 they lost to Larry Bird's Indiana State Sycamores in the Final Four who then went on to lose in an iconic matchup to Magic Johnson's MSU.
Ray Meyer was a good coach, a true student of the game. His teams were solid and fun to watch.
Maybe, don't ask the question that requires a history lesson
Your AI source seems off.
The OP says NINE times a #9 defeated a #1, not eleven.
Your AI list adds James Madison over West Virginia in '83 and Auburn over Purdue in '99.
Per my AI source:
- Based on 1999 NCAA tournament records, Auburn and Purdue did not play each other.
- In the 1983 NCAA Tournament first round, 10th-seeded James Madison upset 7th-seeded West Virginia 57-50 in the East Region
So DePaul lost 3 years in a row (80, 81, 82) in the 2nd round as a #1 seed? Ouch.
and they were never heard from again.
and they were never heard from again.
That doesn't surprise me Google AI was wrong. I tried to feed it your two exceptions to see it's response and I got this: Something went wrong and the content wasn't generated. I guess it doesn't like to admit when it is wrong. I have a Windows update pending, so I'll run that and give it another try. After changing my room in Chicago, the Marriott website stopped responding too, so it's probably something at my end. If I get something new, I'll come back and share it.
This doesn't surprise me, so I fed Google AI your data and this is it's response:
You are absolutely correct. Upon closer review, those specific entries in the previous list were incorrect based on historical records.
- 1999 Error: Auburn (a 1-seed) did not play Purdue (a 10-seed) in the 1999 tournament. Auburn was actually eliminated in the Sweet 16 by Ohio State.
- 1983 Error: In 1983, James Madison was a No. 10 seed, not a No. 9 seed, and they upset West Virginia, who was a No. 7 seed, not a No. 1 seed.
Corrected Round of 32 Upsets (by No. 8 Seeds)
| Year | Winner (8 Seed) | Loser (1 Seed) |
|---|---|---|
| 2023 | Arkansas | Kansas |
| 2022 | North Carolina | Baylor |
| 2021 | Loyola Chicago | Illinois |
| 2017 | Wisconsin | Villanova |
| 2014 | Kentucky | Wichita State |
| 2011 | Butler | Pittsburgh |
| 2004 | Alabama | Stanford |
| 2002 | UCLA | Cincinnati |
| 2000 | North Carolina | Stanford |
| 2000 | Wisconsin | Arizona |
| 1998 | West Virginia | Cincinnati |
| 1996 | Georgia | Purdue |
| 1990 | North Carolina | Oklahoma |
| 1987 | Auburn | Indiana |
| 1986 | Auburn | St. John's |
| 1982 | St. Joseph's | DePaul |
| 1980 | UCLA | DePaul |
Corrected Round of 32 Upsets (by No. 9 Seeds)
| Year | Winner (9 Seed) | Loser (1 Seed) |
|---|---|---|
| 2026 | Iowa | Florida |
| 2018 | Florida State | Xavier |
| 2013 | Wichita State | Gonzaga |
| 2010 | Northern Iowa | Kansas |
| 2004 | UAB | Kentucky |
| 1994 | Boston College | North Carolina |
| 1992 | UTEP | Kansas |
| 1981 | Saint Joseph's | DePaul |
| 1979 | Penn | North Carolina |
Summary of Corrections
- Total Upsets: 26 (17 by 8-seeds, 9 by 9-seeds).
- Removed: 1999 (Auburn vs. Purdue) and 1983 (James Madison vs. West Virginia).
At least Google is nice about it when they are wrong.
I decided I'd check another source, HoopsTournament.Net. It confirms the list of nine 9-seeds. But it found even more discrepancies with the list of 8-seed upsets. Some that shouldn't have been on the list and others that should. It showed at total of 19, bring the total of 1-seeds being upset in the Round of 32 to 28.
Here's the 8-seed upset list from HoopsTournament.Net:
I decided I'd check another source, HoopsTournament.Net. It confirms the list of nine 9-seeds. But it found even more discrepancies with the list of 8-seed upsets. Some that shouldn't have been on the list and others that should. It showed at total of 19, bring the total of 1-seeds being upset in the Round of 32 to 28.
Here's the 8-seed upset list from HoopsTournament.Net:
| Date | Seed | Team | Seed | Opponent | Score | Opp Score | Box Score |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 3/18/2023 | 8 | Arkansas | 1 | Kansas | 72 | 71 | Box Score |
| 3/19/2022 | 8 | North Carolina | 1 | Baylor | 93 | 86 | Box Score |
| 3/21/2021 | 8 | Loyola Chicago | 1 | Illinois | 71 | 58 | Box Score |
| 3/18/2017 | 8 | Wisconsin | 1 | Villanova | 65 | 62 | Box Score |
| 3/21/2015 | 8 | North Carolina State | 1 | Villanova | 71 | 68 | Box Score |
| 3/23/2014 | 8 | Kentucky | 1 | Wichita State | 78 | 76 | Box Score |
| 3/19/2011 | 8 | Butler | 1 | Pittsburgh | 71 | 70 | Box Score |
| 3/20/2004 | 8 | Alabama | 1 | Stanford | 70 | 67 | Box Score |
| 3/17/2002 | 8 | UCLA | 1 | Cincinnati | 105 | 101 | Box Score |
| 3/19/2000 | 8 | North Carolina | 1 | Stanford | 60 | 53 | Box Score |
| 3/18/2000 | 8 | Wisconsin | 1 | Arizona | 66 | 59 | Box Score |
| 3/15/1998 | 8 | Rhode Island | 1 | Kansas | 80 | 75 | Box Score |
| 3/16/1996 | 8 | Georgia | 1 | Purdue | 76 | 69 | Box Score |
| 3/17/1990 | 8 | North Carolina | 1 | Oklahoma | 79 | 77 | Box Score |
| 3/16/1986 | 8 | Auburn | 1 | St. John's | 81 | 65 | Box Score |
| 3/17/1985 | 8 | Villanova | 1 | Michigan | 59 | 55 | Box Score |
| 3/14/1982 | 8 | Boston College | 1 | DePaul | 82 | 75 | Box Score |
| 3/14/1981 | 8 | Kansas State | 1 | Oregon State | 50 | 48 | Box Score |
| 3/9/1980 | 8 | UCLA | 1 | DePaul | 77 | 71 | Box Score |
And Penn also made it to that Final Four. That was before the tournament was expanded. Wasn't it 48 teams then?
I'm still pretty sure there were only 48 teams those days and the higher seeds had byes so it was more like losing in the sweet 16 level. I'd have to research it.
Didn't one of Depaul's teams have both, Aguirre and Cummings on it? Tough to say they underperformed. Different era with no 3 point line or shot clock and schools would recruit players to keep them on the bench instead of face them.
No idea. That was about 10 years before I was born. Just thought it was interesting since I can’t recall DePaul being relevant in my lifetime.
Better under Ray, not so good under Joey as I recall.
Good stuff. Aguirre was a freshman in 78/79 on the team that lost to Bird's Sycamore team in the Final Four. This brings back memories. I guess I'd forgotten how disappointing Depaul played in the tournament those two years. Thank you.
This is incorrect..Since the 64 teams+ era
94- #9 Boston College beat #5 Indiana
13- #9 Wichita St beat #13 LaSalle
18- #9 Florida St beat #4 Gonzaga (FSU is the only team to beat a 8-1-4 seed in that order)
2 other 9 seeds won in the sweet 16.. but that was after beating 16 seeds
18-#9 Kansas State beat #5 Kentucky
23-#9 Florida Atlantic beat #4 Tennessee
To reach the Final 4
Wichita St over #2 Ohio St
Florida Atlantic over #3 Kansas State
Both those teams lost in the Final Four
Wichita St to #1 Louisville by 4(win was vacated)
Florida Atlantic by 1 on a buzzer beater to #5 San Diego State
thanks for the details. i had cut pasted both my search query and google’s response verbatim…apparently ai confidently spews out wrong nonsense