POLL: Should this season be Tom Brands last as HC at Iowa?
- Thread starter LIV4GOD
- Start date
When I say Rome is burning, it doesn't mean Iowa will continue to get worse under Tom. It means I no longer believe that Iowa will get better under Tom. He is good at placing 3-4-5. He is not good at placing 1-2. This is reflected in his individual wrestlers as well: lot of mid-low AAs, few champs. We should not be satisfied with that.
There were 205 YES votes in the middle of the PSU match. There are now 307. That's over a 50% increase.
Polls are worthless—especially this one.
You don’t fire a sitting coach (based on a fan-group's opinion) and then hope a clearly better option magically appears. That’s backwards.
We should keep Brands and replace him only if and when a demonstrably better option becomes available—one that makes sense across the full picture: money, recruiting impact, roster stability, realistic timeline back to #1.
The idea that there’s a coach out there who can instantly take Iowa from #4 to #1 and consistently beat Okie State, Penn State and Ohio State is wishful thinking. No replacement guarantees that.
Even if we somehow leveled the coaching field and landed someone on the level of Gable, Cael, or Taylor, we’re still Iowa—competing against PSU and the OSUs on other factors than the head coach: geography, facilities (we win this one), location, program perception, and resources. Coaching alone doesn’t erase that.
The most realistic—and healthiest—outcome for the sport and Iowa is a top-five rotation where multiple programs trade the #1 spot year to year. Anything else gets stale fast.
We need to stay the course and make sure we don’t miss the next great coach by panicking early. Firing first and hoping later is how programs fall even further behind—not how they stay elite.
You don’t fire a sitting coach (based on a fan-group's opinion) and then hope a clearly better option magically appears. That’s backwards.
We should keep Brands and replace him only if and when a demonstrably better option becomes available—one that makes sense across the full picture: money, recruiting impact, roster stability, realistic timeline back to #1.
The idea that there’s a coach out there who can instantly take Iowa from #4 to #1 and consistently beat Okie State, Penn State and Ohio State is wishful thinking. No replacement guarantees that.
Even if we somehow leveled the coaching field and landed someone on the level of Gable, Cael, or Taylor, we’re still Iowa—competing against PSU and the OSUs on other factors than the head coach: geography, facilities (we win this one), location, program perception, and resources. Coaching alone doesn’t erase that.
The most realistic—and healthiest—outcome for the sport and Iowa is a top-five rotation where multiple programs trade the #1 spot year to year. Anything else gets stale fast.
We need to stay the course and make sure we don’t miss the next great coach by panicking early. Firing first and hoping later is how programs fall even further behind—not how they stay elite.
Last edited:
Who is going to direct your new assistants?
In what screwed up world is Iowa number 3 right now? If Iowa was number 3 this wouldn't even be talked about. Replace the 3 with 5 or 6 and you have found the problem. What is your version of demonstrably better? Finishing higher? Beating Brands in a spelling bee? Being a better public speaker? Was Cael demonstrably better than Brands when he was hired? Was DT? What you are saying is to keep Brands no matter how piss poor he does until some unicorn knocks at the door.
Here I thought he was advocating to keep the Brands and their current level and style of wrestling and associated portal fillers until the Brands step down on their own, which they eventually would.
The inevitable will happen. I don’t see any reason to wait except to save $ by not paying for a contract buyout. Once the Brands step down, Iowa will need to hire a new wrestling head coach. It won't matter whether any unicorns are available.
Then that new head coach could be replaced by the next unicorn once they materialize.
Oh, get off your high horse. This is a message board and the poll is not worthless concerning it. It gives us more to talk about and discuss. It even incited you to post your thoughts . . . which I think are truly the "backwards" ones. But that is ok. It's what message boards are for
Staying the course is a horrible idea…similar to head in sand and hope for the best despite the fact that we’re Failing miserably and have been doing so for a few years. I know some people’s livelihoods are attached to Brands staying at the helm and that sucks, but it’s very obviously time for a change.
My read of the situation is there are two camps of Hawkeye fans. One camp is summarized well by you, you can't fire TnT if you don't have a better option available. That's pretty damn logical. The other camp, in my estimation, is saying " to hell with what Iowa HAS BEEN under TnT, look at at what they currently are. Look at the more recent history on the mat, on the recruiting trail, internationally, etc."
I'm not an Iowa fan, I just like good wrestling and think them being the 1a team would be wonderful for the sport. I feel like you'll never find a candidate that satisfies all of your criteria BUT you could find one who is capable of reaching your goals and providing a reset and breathe of fresh air for an iconic program that is begging to rev back up. You don't know the next great coach until they're given the proper opportunity to show what they can do.
The no takedown thing is definitely a theme. And I would surmise Tom & Terry Brands aren't asking their wrestlers to go out and not score.
So yeah, at some point a good share of the blame has to go on the guys that actually take the mat. Young men that are good enough to wrestle at Iowa have been doing this all their lives, and have been in plenty of tough environments and matches and walked away with their hands raised. Likely because they uummm, scored.
Then you have a guy like Mikey Caliendo that sets a CLEAR example of "this is how it's done". Patrick Kennedy as well, who gives all he has every time out but doesn't have the overall ability Caliendo has. Effort and "want to" is what they bring to the table more than anything IMO. (Stephen Buchanan brought a LOT of that too, and look where it got him.....).
Then you had returning NCAA Finalist & 4x All- American Jacori Teemer, who from my perspective is the poster child for what CAN go horribly wrong in the transfer portal. Lack of Effort will do that to a fan.
Those who shall not be named appear to be on the Jacori Teemer Plan, as Steve Miller so aptly described as "Take the Money and Run". So I'm advocating a new file being created in the portal scouting department named the Stephen Buchanan Plan (Must exhibit clear heart, effort, "want to" and toughness prior to cashing a check).
Regardless of the recruiting method that got them to Iowa City, guys have to put some effort in when they take the mat. And if they support Tom Brands like some clearly say they do, it's time to step up to the plate if you want him as your Coach moving forward.
The athletes are responsible for their individual effort, but the coaches dictate the psychology of the team. Our team psychology needs to change at a fundamental, core level.
What sport are you talking about? College wrestling? Because this poll, here on this site, is much more important and relevant than for typical mass media sports. It's a niche sport. There is a limited, but sometimes focused fan base. It matters because it's a barometer for the undercurrent of concern and resignation that the #1 Fan Base has had enough.
It's why the Hawkeye Wrestling Forum was the de facto meeting place for many of the Sandersons. They came here to "figure wrestling out" and get validation for why the Sandersons success mattered.
The "crazy things" brought up on this site, especially in the past, but relevant again now, have ultimately carried weight. Belatedly, some of these "crazy/unneeded ideas," which likely would have flipped more than a couple Sanderson NCAAs titles to Iowa, were accepted. See: Seeding to 32, scoring changes, automatic stall calls.
So....as the inevitable has become the obvious, so has the POLLING. In the limited world of college wrestling, this "stupid poll" holds much more weight than you are likely ever to understand.
Last edited:
This is spot on my opinion.
I also used to think it was a coaching issue with the scrambling, but if you watch any of the technique videos or practice, Tom and Terry understand what’s going on there and coach through positions. I think our biggest issue in that department is the recruits don’t know how to scramble coming in which is what sets them behind. Some skills can’t be learned proficiently enough in college. Same with riding. Guys that are elite in high school are elite in college. Guys like Desanto can become serviceable on top and turn some lower ranked guys, but there’s only so far you can go when the starting point is 0.
It’s actually why a guy like Borge I think might be the jewel of the class especially considering his training situation now. Only his brother to train with and while he’s a D1 recruit (Mizzou), he’s not a top program starter level.
Agree and I think what you are getting at is that high school success is just the start of evaluating a recruit. Success in high school doesn’t always translate to success in college. Wrestling IQ, scrambling instincts, attitude, athleticism, etc. need to be considered when predicting potential D1 success.
UndercoverHawk said:
""I also used to think it was a coaching issue with the scrambling, but if you watch any of the technique videos or practice, Tom and Terry understand what’s going on there and coach through positions. I think our biggest issue in that department is the recruits don’t know how to scramble coming in which is what sets them behind. Some skills can’t be learned proficiently enough in college. Same with riding. Guys that are elite in high school are elite in college. Guys like Desanto can become serviceable on top and turn some lower ranked guys, but there’s only so far you can go when the starting point is 0.""signed UndercoverHawk
-------------------------------------------------------------**Unbelievable. So you are saying the RECRUITS Brands and Company are getting are not smart enough to get themselves or the Team to the Top. IF this is accurate, why would Brands and Company recruit them? Kind of damning either way for Brands and Company.
Hell no, Jimmy Z was fired for similar outcomes and rightfully so, and the only difference is that Z didn't have the rabid few defending him, financially and verbally. So what are we left with? A very painful year or two of extended drama and disdain for the Brands and their antiquated ways and unbelievable attitude about circling the wagons to the point of choking the Iowa program out completely? This shouldn't be up for debate at all.
I used to think it wasn’t a technique issue until this year. There are widespread deficiencies in the hand fight and scrambling. Those end up causing an issue in output because it’s hard to get clean shots when losing the hand fight. Then it’s also hard to get guys to shoot when it’s not clean because they don’t want to get caught in a scramble or countered.
I will add that if TnT stay I do think there will be better days ahead than we are seeing this year. It’s probably 2-3 years out though realistically.
Maybe I'm missing something, but I didn't get what you just said at all out of UndercoverHawk's post?!
Askren called that out 12 years ago... that's not saying he should or shouldn't be the next coach, its just pointing out, what are we doing here?
Yes, why is the obvious so hard to accept, even in nearly similar situations?
Re: my point to counter some of the Sandersons logic. IF Brands and Company are recruiting guys that can't scramble, hand fight, solve puzzles during a match under duress, then he is the wrong guy to compete for NCAA Championships.
If...then. Reread what he wrote and how he was attempting to defend Brands. He said it wasn't Brands fault if the guys can't figure it out. If you are coach and your guys--the guys YOU RECRUIT-- can't figure out your system, the coach needs to adjust his system or get guys who can "figure out (Brands) the system." The results are in. FAILED. Will not adjust or does NOT KNOW HOW to adjust his approach; can not recruit or poach the type of guys needed for HIS SYSTEM.
Brands and Company use no excuses, so they will understand and respect the decision. Why so many use emotional ties and memories to cling to tired, lost excuses is something bordering on disrespect to Brands and Company. They respect winning. They can not argue they are meeting their own lofty standards, so why would fans.
I wish I had 1/100 of the talent most of our men have. And because they're so talented I've got to believe that with the right people in the room they can be taught new/different techniques, right? I mean how many hours a week do they spend in the room working techniques. Sure to God we can teach them something other than handfighting for 7 minutes? And if one has the defensive talent of say a Brandon Sorenson or Angelo Ferrari then that might be the key to having a great career, but our guys don't have that defense...and aside from Mikey, Drake, and perpahs PK they don't have any offense either. I love our guys and TNT are my heroes from back in the day when they we're killing it on the mat, but we're just not getting it done. Whether it's recruiting (we all know is an issue) or something else, we clearly have a problem and sadly I don't think the current staff makeup can fix what ails us.
This is my current view as well. Of course coaching/training is still important for honing, but our biggest failure is in recruiting. And the traits you list above are spot on. Guys who have fast firing (instinctive) but flexible, calm, and unafraid minds, combined with the right body type or athleticism, are critical. Rarely is coaching/training, or a sports psychologist, going to create that in 4 years with a 19 year old whose mind is not largely that way already. A sports psychologist can certainly help 'change the spark plug' when a wrestler struggles a bit with some mental block, but they ain't redesigning the engine. I've no clue whether we rarely get that type of guy because TnT prefer another prototype, agree but are poor at identifying recruits with that prototype, or agree and can identify but simply can't convince them to come for various reasons others have suggested (e.g., weaker club, 'old style' image). Even when we get very high ranked recruits, it is often quickly clear to me that some do not have the 'right mind' or required athleticism. May indeed be mid-level AA, but not elite.
they’re paying him $9 million over two years. Like every such contract, it had an offset clause.FFS. Do you think those PSU Idiot's liked the "guarantee" they got from James Franklin?They just paid that loser $50 million to walk away. Not too bright I would say.
I voted, yes. I have 8 season tickets, I'm an inner circle member, and I send my kids to Iowa camps. I'm a supporter of Iowa Wrestling.
When it's time it's time. I respect the hell out of TNT and this Iowa staff but its time for a new chapter.
When it's time it's time. I respect the hell out of TNT and this Iowa staff but its time for a new chapter.
Not sold on ousting T/T as I don’t know who a replacement would be. On the flip side, something needs to change - be it staff changes or something else. Losing to an so-so Minnesota squad … ISU for the first time in forever … and then the worst blowout loss in decades versus PSU - definitely doesn’t feel like we are heading in the right direction. With the fans and resources and commitment from the AD … we should always be in the top 3-4 and we have to close the gap with PSU (and soon - Okie State)… this is a program with immense fan support … it’s tough seeing us regress … we need to right the ship … next year I believe T/T will feel the heat …
