I didn’t ask what the team’s flaws were. Every team has flaws. By the way the 1966 Rupp’s runts played a tight rotation as well. I’m asking you to be consistent here. Go ahead and say the 1967 and 1976 teams were untalented. I dare ya
Mark Pope glazes JMI and Mitch
- Thread starter RunninRichie
- Start date
I agree, most people thought our roster was a top ten roster. For those who honestly said otherwise pre season I tip my cap to them for recognizing a problem that so many missed (myself included).
Spin. Talent matters. Coaching matters. Coaching can elevate not so talented teams (Purdue). But talent can also elevate coaching. What we have here, is piss poor coaching. Mixed with subpar talent. Nowhere did I say team chemistry didn't matter or injuries. If the talent was as good as the media and Pom said. We wouldn't be 0-4 in Q1 games.
I don’t think talent is the problem at all, but at least those people are consistent.
You can always tell when you’re dealing with dishonesty if someone can’t answer a basic question. Is the 1967 team untalented? Also, is the 1976 team untalented?
Your surrender is noted.
Mark really shouldn’t have said what he said. Anyone who can see what’s going on here needs to turn it in with him. I gave him more than a fair shot. He’s coming in and he’s a yes man, he wants to cover for failure. They’re all making money and people in charge care nothing about winning. Now Kentucky, you either clear these men out of here or you lose your program. This isn’t a hard call, these guys are not winners, they’re collectors. This is about keeping as much money in house for themselves and the library buildings as possible and getting the fanbase to accept average so they don’t pay out. They do not want to win.
Pope just solidified why he’s here. Mitch finally got control over the basketball program. This is what he does with control.
Pope just solidified why he’s here. Mitch finally got control over the basketball program. This is what he does with control.
I have no idea how Riley was as a player but he's obviously a HOF basketball mind. Would be an interesting data project to see the impact that having a future successful coach has on the success of a team. I haven't seen any study like this? Make it happen, Village!
I know people said it's his boss. But if Pope loves UK as much as he says. And is a Pitino guy. Why not call a spade a spade? Ride for this program. Barnhart won't like it, but who GAF? Everyone knows the problem here. And Pope is siding with the corrupt administration rather than the program and university he claims to love.
Call it surrender if you want. You could t answer the question and I don’t blame you. It wasn’t in your best interest to stand by the fire. Don’t worry, 99% of the website agrees with you and you’ll be get away with nonsense because it reinforces their presuppositions. No team looks talented while playing awful basketball, it doesn’t undermine the truth. I didn’t bring up the 2021 team, very talented—- awful roster fit. Multiple guys playing in the league and went 9-16. I just wish people tried to dig deeper rather than always being lazy and calling everything a talent issue. Pope is responsible for this clunker — in my mind, even more so. Because he was handed a lot.
Maybe someday for sure. That’s an interesting idea.
Because I answered your question. You're trying to paint me into a corner here. "Duh he thinks talent only matters". When I didn't say that once. We have a mix of bad coaching and subpar talent. There's a reason Mo D and Zel didn't start. JQ is the legit only elite talent we have on this squad. We have role players starting. The rest of the team is so-so.
Just ask yourself, what player would start on any of UK's title winning teams past 1960? For me that's JQ. Nobody else.
It was during the offseason when everyone including myself was glued to the portal and making my own observations
I have so much respect for people who make their own observations. I did my own and came to a different conclusion but major respect.
You didn’t my question so I won’t answer yours. Yes, it was clear I was painting you into a corner. That was not a stealth mission. I’ll leave it there.
I agree. It hasn't translated into wins and excellence on the court which is all that counts.
If it makes you feel better, I drank the kool-aid in the off-season. I figured with Pope's offense and going to the sweet 16 with portal scraps. We were destined to be a top 5 team. I figured the offense would elevate these guys. Mo D would be an enforcer for us. Defense would be improved. Kam Williams would be shooting it from deep like Brea. Oweh would come back and put up 12-15 a night, etc etc. Heres a quote from me in April. But reality has sat in. And I see the talent (and the coaching) isn't as good as I thought it would be on paper. Roster doesn't have enough shooting for Pope's offense. And it doesn't even look like he's even running the same O as last year. Probably because he's being recruited against (who wants to play 22mpg), etc etc. Im making my own observations too.
So you came to same conclusion I did that this was a really good roster talent-wise. There was plenty of film for everyone we added from the portal except for Kam. There were only a few full games I could find of him. Did you review these guys and come to your own conclusions or did you just read websites and accept someone else’s analysis?
Lot's of assumptions by me. I assumed Kam would shoot close to 38% from 3. Oweh would play the same as he did last season. Mo D would bring a toughness and culture of defnese to the team. I wasn't thrilled with BG returning. But, like I said, I was high on the sweet 16/Pope's offense. And believed it would all work out.
Yeah I’m with you 100%. I get not sense of urgency out of pope. It’s all positive platitudes. And the ugh ugh ugh
This is the narrative for every regime before it falls. The entire fiasco is escalating and a loss to IU will be gasoline
An IU loss is the end for the Pope era. The fanbase support will be gone. At that point he's a lame duck. Recruits and their families/agents/etc will know it too. Pretty wild how fast the wheels fell off.
I’m reading that to mean you relied on others for analysis. Here’s what I’ll say. Two things can be correct simultaneously:
1.) it is correct that Pope did NOT get what many of us believe were his first choices. We can argue about why or why not, but this should be a point of agreement to any reasonable person.
2.) there is plenty of talent on this team. Most coaches would trade this roster for theirs in a heartbeat, assuming health.
We have to be able to recognize that sometimes things cause talented teams to appear untalented. There’s a reason I mentioned 1967 to you. That was the year after the Rupp’s Runts national runner-up season, where we were #1 wire to wire. We returned most of that squad, except Larry Conley and went 13-13. A lot of people felt that morale destroyed that team. The post 1966 world was a completely different monster for Kentucky basketball and while individual numbers looked good for Riley, there were people who said he wasn’t mentally the same after ‘66. Rupp coached that squad and he was responsible for the results, but make no mistake that team was both talented and stunk.
1976 is an example of a team that had a world of talent. Larry Johnson, Goose Givens, Mike Phillips, James Lee. Problem there is an injury to Rick Robey detailed the season. He came back late and we won the NIT. Very talented team, nowhere near “Kentucky standards”, although we should acknowledge that was prior to 64 team field so an NIT title meant more then.
I don’t expect everyone to agree on everything, but honesty and consistency matter to me on this topic. Why? Suppose Pope doesn’t fix this and gets fired…how we diagnose the failure today will affect how we try to fix it in the future. There are coaches out there that could kill it here, but if people come to the wrong conclusions today those guys won’t get a shot and we will be right back here arguing again about why we stink.
No, actually I’m feeling good. I live for a good sports debate!
My biggest takeaway from the interview is that it would not be realistic to expect Mark Pope to come out and blast JMI and trash his athletic director. In the first place that would be like one of our players going to the media and talking all sorts of trash about a teammate. These people still have to work with each other.
More practically if Pope is in fact feeling the pressure the biggest thing he could do to heat up his own seat would be to publicly criticize his boss. He is much better off to brush aside his critics rather than to bite one of the biggest hands that feeds him. So if you were expecting some sort of blunt exposure from Mark Pope on this I don't know what you were thinking.
More practically if Pope is in fact feeling the pressure the biggest thing he could do to heat up his own seat would be to publicly criticize his boss. He is much better off to brush aside his critics rather than to bite one of the biggest hands that feeds him. So if you were expecting some sort of blunt exposure from Mark Pope on this I don't know what you were thinking.
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Let’s go political and sprinkle in some religion. Jed loves that!No, actually I’m feeling good. I live for a good sports debate!
Wow. You guys go to work tomorrow and call a press conference and in it announce your boss is an incompetent crook. See what happens. Yet that's exactly what some of you want Pope to do. Grow up!
It’s not that, I don’t expect him to blast them. If he really cares, he won’t blast them, but he will just accept accountability and say nothing about JMI or Barnhart. That’s now what he did. He’s using it for cover because Mitch must be the AD for him to keep his job. That I won’t do. The media needs to ask, nobody is going by rules. The ncaa is giving no sanctions. Why are you following rules that no one else is even the NCAA?
Mark needs Mitch right now so I want them both gone. They’re coving to maintain jobs during vast underperformance.
Again, say NOTHING about it. Talk about YOURSELF and accountability for putting a terrible product on the floor. Getting into “everyone else is cheating so” and “gaslighting us about JMI is total BS and not going to work here. He needs Mitch for his own job security and Mitch wants a guy he can control. He’s had no control in 15 years and he’s got the guy that gives him that. No more back scratching. This is Kentucky. PRODUCE.
Pope, JMI, and Mitch all deserve each other.
I couldn't think of a worse way to handle the situation.
I started a thread a few days ago asking if Pope was just being a good soldier and staying quiet. Well in no way did I expect him to blast Barnhart or JMI but to say they are great etc was not too bright. Now he owns it 100%.
Pope says he has great support well then POPE owns it all. The no players signed is on him. He doesn’t seem to want a GM. The erring on the side of not breaking rules when NOBODY knows the rules is just stupid. Is everybody but UK going to get punished. He better turn it around ASAP.
I just have ZERO confidence after watching that conference in him, Mitch or anything associated with UK Athletics that this isn’t a complete cluster.
Pope says he has great support well then POPE owns it all. The no players signed is on him. He doesn’t seem to want a GM. The erring on the side of not breaking rules when NOBODY knows the rules is just stupid. Is everybody but UK going to get punished. He better turn it around ASAP.
I just have ZERO confidence after watching that conference in him, Mitch or anything associated with UK Athletics that this isn’t a complete cluster.
No one wants to hear my far right political views or my extremely orthodox religious views lol
That’s why he got the job. Realistically only Cal would come out and diss Mitch publicly, but Pope will never give an honest response about that.
I bet they are. How did you get the university to sign a crap deal while making yourself so rich? Let me in on that. How do I convince the overseers that this deal is actually legit?
We will find out after yet another disappointing game I’m sure. I don’t want to lose to Indiana but I have a nasty feeling threes are about to rain down in Rupp and it won’t be us doing it.
Oweh and Chandler are great starter level players, they just can’t carry a roster unfortunately which is ridiculous for the cash we spent. Maybe JQ changes some of that but without an elite PG and backup we are fraudulent anyway.